WorstCases
08-18-2008, 02:19 AM
Hello,
I'm new here and quite new to HHO in general.
I'm glad I found this forum since I've been searching throught google during the last few days.
Be prepared: I have some things to share with you - maybe you want to get yourself a beer first...
Another hint: English is only my second language.
So please don't blame me if I'm doing some misspelling or weird grammar, better help me out...
Initially I've been attracted to HHO by a Van with an ad "I drive with water" a few days ago.
I've seen the car on the road and since I'm a curious, but also skeptic person, I just needed to call the number on his van, hoping that it is the drivers cell-phone. It was, so I asked him to stop.
He showed me his system and told be he did build everything by hisself. He didn't tell me that it's the Water4Gas-system. But after my research during the last das I found out that he had the water4gas-system. It's been the coil in the glass jar. Inside the van he had this electronic box for manipulating the ECU and switching between city and hightway.
He told me, he gets about 600 miles per gas tank, which I can hardly beleave. If that would be true, his Gas-Mileage would almost be twice than without HHO. It was a 200k+ miles Voyager or similar. On the other side, even if it's not proving anything I took a quick look at his gas gauge and the odometer while his engine was idling. Gas-Gauge was a bit above 1/2 and the miles close to 300. But as I said, that's not a proof. Maybe he just didn't reset his odometer when he filled-up his gas-tank the last time.
Anyway - since I talked to this guy I was curious enought to make some more research about HHO. Finally I'm just fascinated about HHO and the whole community behind it, like here in the forum or on youtube etc.
Main reason: Whatever we do to try cut down our use of oil will help. We need to do everything to get less dependent to oil.
If youhave another 90minutes after you've read my post take a look at this video from Lindsay Williams: <br>
<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/NbakN7SLdbk&hl=de&fs=1"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/NbakN7SLdbk&hl=de&fs=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>
I'm ready to start my own experiments and build my own generator.
First important thing is the housing... And here, just at the beginning I'm stuck.
I know, lots of you may have done it out of glass, PVC oder Polyethylne.
But all these products have lots of disadvantages, as far as I could find out.
First I wanted to buid my Generator as the one I've seen in the Van. Easy to build. But I'm really skeptic if this wire can produce a good amount of HHO without pulling too many amps, cooking the water and working inefficient. And also I really don't want to have glass under my hood.
So I came to the second Idea and wanted to build my generator similar to the one from "ZeroFossilFuel" or the one from the guy named "Smack". Both are out of 4 inch PVC pipe. I loved this idea since PCV is cheap and available alomst everywhere with all kinds of fittings and that great PVC-cement. And even better: There are also clear PVC-pipes available to be able to look at the cells itself while they produce the HHO.
But from some other work with PVC I knew that it melts pretty easy. So I had to check a little bit more on it's avability to stand heat.
I didn't like, what I've found. PVC is rated with a max temp of 140°f (60°C). Since most of you already know: That's for sure not enought, especially not it the generator it in the engine-compartment, surrounded by the heat of the engine itself.
So bottom-line is: For some temporary testing PVC might be fine, but not for an installation an a car.
So third idea was Polyethylene. I found this suggetion here in the forum. It seems to be a good choice if we're looking at the heat- and chemical resistance. But on the other side I wonder if I build a housing out of cutted sheets, if it will ever be 100% HHO tight, not only for short term, also long-term.
Big disadvantage so far seems to be that there's no glue availabe for this material as it is for PVC. So PE-Housings need to be screwed together with a thick silicone (or similar) layer between the sheets.
Fourth idea after some more research is CPVC. It's having all the benefit from the regular PVC, but can stand heat up to about 200°f (93°C). That's around there where water might start to vaporise. But I'm not sure if it won't get hotter than 200°f under the hood while driving in the city.
I've seen a post from somebody who wants to use a SS housing. But I wonder how that would work. If the SS is mounted to the car without an insulation all around it'll become a negative cell since it's grounded to the car itself. Seems to be kind of risky for me...
Is there some other material which might work?
Here a list of important things the preferred material shoud have:
- resist heat (enought to stand the heat of the cell and the engine-compartment)
- easy to cut
- putting it together must be save (no leaks for the gas)
- long-lasting
What are your suggestions?
Greetings to the whole HHO-community.
WorstCases
I'm new here and quite new to HHO in general.
I'm glad I found this forum since I've been searching throught google during the last few days.
Be prepared: I have some things to share with you - maybe you want to get yourself a beer first...
Another hint: English is only my second language.
So please don't blame me if I'm doing some misspelling or weird grammar, better help me out...
Initially I've been attracted to HHO by a Van with an ad "I drive with water" a few days ago.
I've seen the car on the road and since I'm a curious, but also skeptic person, I just needed to call the number on his van, hoping that it is the drivers cell-phone. It was, so I asked him to stop.
He showed me his system and told be he did build everything by hisself. He didn't tell me that it's the Water4Gas-system. But after my research during the last das I found out that he had the water4gas-system. It's been the coil in the glass jar. Inside the van he had this electronic box for manipulating the ECU and switching between city and hightway.
He told me, he gets about 600 miles per gas tank, which I can hardly beleave. If that would be true, his Gas-Mileage would almost be twice than without HHO. It was a 200k+ miles Voyager or similar. On the other side, even if it's not proving anything I took a quick look at his gas gauge and the odometer while his engine was idling. Gas-Gauge was a bit above 1/2 and the miles close to 300. But as I said, that's not a proof. Maybe he just didn't reset his odometer when he filled-up his gas-tank the last time.
Anyway - since I talked to this guy I was curious enought to make some more research about HHO. Finally I'm just fascinated about HHO and the whole community behind it, like here in the forum or on youtube etc.
Main reason: Whatever we do to try cut down our use of oil will help. We need to do everything to get less dependent to oil.
If youhave another 90minutes after you've read my post take a look at this video from Lindsay Williams: <br>
<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/NbakN7SLdbk&hl=de&fs=1"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/NbakN7SLdbk&hl=de&fs=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>
I'm ready to start my own experiments and build my own generator.
First important thing is the housing... And here, just at the beginning I'm stuck.
I know, lots of you may have done it out of glass, PVC oder Polyethylne.
But all these products have lots of disadvantages, as far as I could find out.
First I wanted to buid my Generator as the one I've seen in the Van. Easy to build. But I'm really skeptic if this wire can produce a good amount of HHO without pulling too many amps, cooking the water and working inefficient. And also I really don't want to have glass under my hood.
So I came to the second Idea and wanted to build my generator similar to the one from "ZeroFossilFuel" or the one from the guy named "Smack". Both are out of 4 inch PVC pipe. I loved this idea since PCV is cheap and available alomst everywhere with all kinds of fittings and that great PVC-cement. And even better: There are also clear PVC-pipes available to be able to look at the cells itself while they produce the HHO.
But from some other work with PVC I knew that it melts pretty easy. So I had to check a little bit more on it's avability to stand heat.
I didn't like, what I've found. PVC is rated with a max temp of 140°f (60°C). Since most of you already know: That's for sure not enought, especially not it the generator it in the engine-compartment, surrounded by the heat of the engine itself.
So bottom-line is: For some temporary testing PVC might be fine, but not for an installation an a car.
So third idea was Polyethylene. I found this suggetion here in the forum. It seems to be a good choice if we're looking at the heat- and chemical resistance. But on the other side I wonder if I build a housing out of cutted sheets, if it will ever be 100% HHO tight, not only for short term, also long-term.
Big disadvantage so far seems to be that there's no glue availabe for this material as it is for PVC. So PE-Housings need to be screwed together with a thick silicone (or similar) layer between the sheets.
Fourth idea after some more research is CPVC. It's having all the benefit from the regular PVC, but can stand heat up to about 200°f (93°C). That's around there where water might start to vaporise. But I'm not sure if it won't get hotter than 200°f under the hood while driving in the city.
I've seen a post from somebody who wants to use a SS housing. But I wonder how that would work. If the SS is mounted to the car without an insulation all around it'll become a negative cell since it's grounded to the car itself. Seems to be kind of risky for me...
Is there some other material which might work?
Here a list of important things the preferred material shoud have:
- resist heat (enought to stand the heat of the cell and the engine-compartment)
- easy to cut
- putting it together must be save (no leaks for the gas)
- long-lasting
What are your suggestions?
Greetings to the whole HHO-community.
WorstCases