New here - need help debugging my dry cell

[tkotitan]

Hi All,

It's a long story how I came across HHO last year while I was travelling the country with my '94 4.0 Jeep XJ. I am an engineer and understand the science of why this works, but most sites I find are written by tinkerers who do not understand that it is the combination of hydrogen and oxygen gas that boosts power, not just the hydrogen.

Anyway, after doing a lot of searching I bought a 21 plate dry cell kit from hho2u.com. It took forever to get but I did get it, and haven't gotten any support.

Here are the steps I went through:

Setup everything, wiring was good. Filled kit with distilled water to see if anything would happen. Nothing happened.

Finally put 3oz of KOH in my mix, and nothing happened with 30 minutes of running it. Drove home over a bumpy dirty road and it started working. I guess it took a while for the KOH to get down to the dry cell and in between the plates.

The noticed effect was my gears were effectively wider, for exampleI used to shift into 5th around 45mph and how had to shift at 55mph to avoid lugging the engine. I reset the OBDI computer by grounding the battery, and the shifting profile was the same as original, with HHO running.

So I take a trip this past weekend, assuming it is working, and it isn't. My bubbler is empty. I filled the bubbler and still no work.

Is it possible that I lost all the KOH with no bubbler? It does bounce around a bit, right on my steering column sometimes, but it stays upright. I should get a clear bubbler.

I did not install the ammeter included in the kit because it is damn near impossible to read. I need a cheap, decent one.

I just dumped maybe 1oz of KOH back in the reservoir with no results.I figure I need to drain the whole system. Was thinking of doing this with a manual turkey-baster style siphon hose.

I did not condition the plates first, 316L, is supposed to have minimal carbon. Now I see someblack sediment on the floor of my water tank.

What I do not understand is the flow through the reservoir. Obviously it is full sending water down to the dry cell.The return line goes back to the tank at about the water fill line. Should the return be submerged air? The top air goes down to water in the bubbler so I don't understand how the gas get in there, with pressure/flow dynamics. If anyone can explain to me, I appreciate it.

[Havens78]

The attached picture is the easiest way I can explain how a unit needs to be installed.

Are you mixing your KOH into the water before you refill your reservoir? This needs to be mixed (completely) before you fill your unit with water.

You mentioned that your bubbler is empty? You have a secondary bubbler added to your system? If you only have what the manufacture sent you, you might look for a leak as you shouldn't have used all your electrolyte that quickly.

Running the amp gauge will be a good idea even if you have to mount it in the engine compartment, increase your KOH percentage in your water (mixed) until you get your unit up to around 10 amps.

Can you post up some pics? We'll be glad to help where we can.

Edit:
Just noticed that the kits they sell do have a separate bubbler, is there a one way valve attached to the inlet hose to the bubbler? If not, the heat generated by the reactor will pull the contents of your bubbler into the reservoir.

[tkotitan]

Thanks for the reply!

I gather from that picture, both lines to the generator need to be submerged at the reservoir level? Also,should the bubbler bottom be higher than the outlet of the top of the reservoir? I only have so much room under my hood so the bubbler is lower than the reservoir. The bubbler has one inlet at the bottom and no return anywhere, it just goes into the intake. I would like to make a clear PVC one so I can see the level.

No,I don't think I have a one-way valve in the bubbler. where do I get one?

I never started with a clean system and then added KOH mix. I pre-mixed initially but added it to distilled. Hopefully I can drain it all with the siphon, but I will probably have to unscrew the generator and dump it out.

[hhofox]

Hi, just start over with the whole installation. Remove all of the liquid in the bubbler and reservoir, rinse out the bubbler, and set it all back up.
The basic set up is this:
3 parts -Reservoir, Reactor, Bubbler.
Hose at the base of the Reservoir runs to base of Reactor
Hose at the top of the Reactor, runs to port set up 4/5 up the way up on Reservoir.(Water level in Reservoir is below this port)
Port at the Top/Cover of Reservoir goes to bottom of bubbler.
Port at the Top/Cover of Bubbler goes to engine.
The water level of the bubbler depends on how much vacuum it getting.
You do not want water to be sucked in.

Mix your KoH solution, then add it to the system, allowing it a bit of time to saturate things and level out. The reservoir should be about 2/3 filled when done.
Feel free to ask any more questions.
Oh, I almost forgot. The reservoir's base should be between 1/2 and 3/4 of the way up the Reactor. eg. Reactor is 6" tall; reservoir base is at about 4" to 5" level.

[tkotitan]

Just reset the system, it is running now to wait for it to mix. Good thing I bought 2 pounds of KOH.

Should the return line (HHO out of the reactor) have water in it,or just air? I have just air right now, because it is easier to add water later.

Also, where could I find a one-way valve into the bubbler? A pic of one online would help, I have 3/8" hose. I can only find ones for plumbing that are huge, and I have some doubt as to if the gas would push past the stop valve.

Have not installed the ammeter which goes 0, line, line, 30. So 10 amps is one tick on the gauge and it is almost impossible to read. If anyone could find me one on ebay for less than 20 bucks in the use and shipped in the us, I would appreciate it.

[hhofox]

Good to hear that you have things going again!
Just in case I misunderstood what you were asking, you have only 1 hose connecting the reactor and the bubbler right? Remember that the bubbler exists to clean the air coming out of your reactor. It is also said to help prevent flashbacks, but should not be depended on for that.

The reservoir feeds the rector, and the reactor sends HHO (and some foamy water) back to the rector ABOVE the water line. This way, the water falls back into the mix, and the gas goes out the top of the reservoir, into the bubbler, and to the engine.

I use a regular automotive check valve to regulate back-pressure from the engine to the bubbler. The Brake booster check valve, or the smaller vacuum line check valves work for me. I just popped into the local junk yard, found a few, tested them, and attached them. Ensure that they check valves take very little pressure to open, okay?
BTW.... Measure your output using the bottle method man. Then calculate the amount you need for your engine, then get cracking!

[tkotitan]

OK, got things working now. I refilled things and nothing happened. Bugged my electrical friend and the hot line out of the relay was melted, for some reason a crappy unused tap splice was in it and it was just cooked. Re-wired and working fine again.

I would like a voltmeter/ammeter combo that works with 12v in 1 unit increments so I can monitor the amps and see if the voltage cuts out, like another wire melting.

How does the bottle method work? I assume you put a gas line into a 2L bottle and time the duration it takes to overflow water, but I don't have a long enough piece of line left. I can be clueless so clear instructions on this would help.

I have attached a simple image of my setup, right side where my air box used to be, Air filter moved to see.

[tkotitan]

So,it appears my bubbler is sucking water back into the reservoir, I plan to go to a plumbing store to find a one way valve soon.

Just did a road test of 24 miles and used 1.00 gallons of gas, so 24mpg in a jeep that normally gets 19 at best. So that's close to a 30% increase in mileage. Hopefully a longer trip will give a better read.