low LPM

[Jamesleaper]

Ok ive just added a 13 plate generator 200mm * 200mm square to my existing 25 plate 150mm * 100mm, the 25 plate was producing a little 0.6 LPM ive now added a larger unit as well as the existing unit and i am now getting 0.5 LPM ?!

Cant figure that out, so if anyone has any ideas please tell.

I have a 28% mix ratio and i am pulling 36mv via a shunt 75mv at 50amp. I also have a 30 amp PWM connected which i have cranked right up, (i am expecting the fuse to blow).

I intend to change the Mix incase i miscalculated, other than that i have no idea, any comments appreciated.

video shows the set up

http://youtu.be/b9xbVv3Igvg

[BioFarmer93]

James,
We can't tell a thing about what the problem could be from your description or the video- all we can do is make guesses. I suggest you pull both units out of the car along with the PWM (since it's no longer needed with so much plate area) and set them on the bench to photo or video them so we can see connections and spacing etc. When you say 28% I assume you mean 280 grams of KOH to 720cc of distilled water? Please hook up one reactor at a time via heavy gauge wires to your battery while the engine is running at a high idle (1000 rpm) with NO PWM in the circuit- this is a test and we must eliminate as many variables as possible. Measure the output and video the act so we can admire your eudiometer. Since you gave no info on the build, we don't have a clue if you ate greasy chips before assembling the reactor without washing your hands and put greasy fingerprints all over the un-sanded, un-washed un-media blasted un-cleaned plates.. Just having a bit of fun there, but you see what I'm saying, right? We need a good bit more info to be of real help, as all we could do now is play 50 questions.

[Jamesleaper]

James,
We can't tell a thing about what the problem could be from your description or the video- all we can do is make guesses. I suggest you pull both units out of the car along with the PWM (since it's no longer needed with so much plate area) and set them on the bench to photo or video them so we can see connections and spacing etc. When you say 28% I assume you mean 280 grams of KOH to 720cc of distilled water? Please hook up one reactor at a time via heavy gauge wires to your battery while the engine is running at a high idle (1000 rpm) with NO PWM in the circuit- this is a test and we must eliminate as many variables as possible. Measure the output and video the act so we can admire your eudiometer. Since you gave no info on the build, we don't have a clue if you ate greasy chips before assembling the reactor without washing your hands and put greasy fingerprints all over the un-sanded, un-washed un-media blasted un-cleaned plates.. Just having a bit of fun there, but you see what I'm saying, right? We need a good bit more info to be of real help, as all we could do now is play 50 questions.

Ok will strip down the assembly and bench test, just to confirm, you say there is no need for PWM with that concentration, ithought it gave better production of HHO and kept system cooler?
Also, i sanded the plates, but care was not taken regard to greasy dirty hands, could this have such a dramatic affect? thanks jim

[BioFarmer93]

Ok will strip down the assembly and bench test, just to confirm, you say there is no need for PWM with that concentration, ithought it gave better production of HHO and kept system cooler?
Also, i sanded the plates, but care was not taken regard to greasy dirty hands, could this have such a dramatic affect? thanks jim

Jim,
"Concentration" refers to electrolyte strength, not number of plates. You didn't state whether you had connected the second unit independently, in series, or in parallel, so it's difficult if not impossible to ascertain the voltage & amperage supplied to the reactors. The plate's configuration (pos, neg, neutral and number) as well as preparation, flatness, hole location & size all play a role in production volume.

PWM's are not necessary on any 6 neutral and larger 5 neutral reactors- the latter of which are usually heat regulated by coming off a bit from the 28% max KOH concentration. A 6 neutral reactor of any physical size will not overheat due to the voltage distribution (in a nominal 12V system) across the cells being closer to the idealized production efficiency norm. This simply means the available voltage is not wasted in heat that is produced when the voltage too greatly exceeds that which is necessary for gas production.

Dirty/oily hands during reactor assembly are anathema to good production. Anywhere that skin oils (or any other occluding material) are on a plate results in a non-productive area. It is not much of an exaggeration to say that the best built reactors are prepared and assembled in an almost "surgically" clean manner.

Please relate to us the plate thickness, gasket thickness, connection method, plate preparation steps, etc. so that an accurate analysis can be conducted- and we should be able to have you bubbling away in no time... Take care-

[Jamesleaper]

Jim,
"Concentration" refers to electrolyte strength, not number of plates. You didn't state whether you had connected the second unit independently, in series, or in parallel, so it's difficult if not impossible to ascertain the voltage & amperage supplied to the reactors. The plate's configuration (pos, neg, neutral and number) as well as preparation, flatness, hole location & size all play a role in production volume.

PWM's are not necessary on any 6 neutral and larger 5 neutral reactors- the latter of which are usually heat regulated by coming off a bit from the 28% max KOH concentration. A 6 neutral reactor of any physical size will not overheat due to the voltage distribution (in a nominal 12V system) across the cells being closer to the idealized production efficiency norm. This simply means the available voltage is not wasted in heat that is produced when the voltage too greatly exceeds that which is necessary for gas production.

Dirty/oily hands during reactor assembly are anathema to good production. Anywhere that skin oils (or any other occluding material) are on a plate results in a non-productive area. It is not much of an exaggeration to say that the best built reactors are prepared and assembled in an almost "surgically" clean manner.

Please relate to us the plate thickness, gasket thickness, connection method, plate preparation steps, etc. so that an accurate analysis can be conducted- and we should be able to have you bubbling away in no time... Take care-

I've videoed the build, the plates and gaskets are 1mm thick and the stainless plate is supposed to be 366l however i Dont know how to tell that other than a certificate of authenticity. The holes for the inlet where drilled half way up and i placed them incorrectly and as a consequence had to put another hole for the outlet at the top. Electrical connection; i connected the 2nd unit direct to the 1st, could do with some advice on that.

http://youtu.be/55ixzr1b92Y

Thanks jim

[aceras624]

did you really mean "366L"? or did you mean to say 316L?

[Jamesleaper]

did you really mean "366L"? or did you mean to say 316L?

Yes sorry, 316L

[BioFarmer93]

I've videoed the build, the plates and gaskets are 1mm thick and the stainless plate is supposed to be 366l however i Dont know how to tell that other than a certificate of authenticity. The holes for the inlet where drilled half way up and i placed them incorrectly and as a consequence had to put another hole for the outlet at the top. Electrical connection; i connected the 2nd unit direct to the 1st, could do with some advice on that.

http://youtu.be/55ixzr1b92Y

Thanks jim

Jim,
Did you connect the positive of the first device to the positive of the second device, and same with the negatives and have those doubled wires connected to the appropriate supply (parallel), or did you supply power in to the positive of the first device with its negative connected to the positive of the second device with its negative connected to the ground (earth) or negative lead to battery (series)?

[Jamesleaper]

Jim,
Did you connect the positive of the first device to the positive of the second device, and same with the negatives and have those doubled wires connected to the appropriate supply (parallel), or did you supply power in to the positive of the first device with its negative connected to the positive of the second device with its negative connected to the ground (earth) or negative lead to battery (series)?

the first unit positive is connected to the battery,(via relay switch), the negative is connected to earth via the car chassis, not directly to the battery. The second units positive is connected to the first units positive, and the 2nd units negative is connected to the car chassis.

[D.O.G]

the first unit positive is connected to the battery,(via relay switch), the negative is connected to earth via the car chassis, not directly to the battery. The second units positive is connected to the first units positive, and the 2nd units negative is connected to the car chassis.
Have you checked the actual voltage at each reactor while they're running? It sounds like you may have too much voltage drop in the supply circuit.

If the voltage is much lower than at the battery (around 13.8V with the vehicle running), work backwards from the new reactor, checking each connection as you go, looking for changes in the voltage readings.

Sharing the positive wiring may be an issue depending on the wire size you've used.
Using the vehicle chassis may introduce a small drop.
The shunt will introduce a small drop, even the relay, PWM or fuse connections may contribute as well.

[Jamesleaper]

Have you checked the actual voltage at each reactor while they're running? It sounds like you may have too much voltage drop in the supply circuit.

If the voltage is much lower than at the battery (around 13.8V with the vehicle running), work backwards from the new reactor, checking each connection as you go, looking for changes in the voltage readings.

Sharing the positive wiring may be an issue depending on the wire size you've used.
Using the vehicle chassis may introduce a small drop.
The shunt will introduce a small drop, even the relay, PWM or fuse connections may contribute as well.

I checked the difference between each plate on the first reactor they are 1.97 volts on the second reactor they are 1.65volts. When i connected the earth to the battery i couldnt get the reactor to work, hence i used the chasis as earth.

[Jamesleaper]

the wire size is 2.5mm2. I also think it may be poor circulation within the unit. I was thinking of adding another set of inlets and outlets on the other face of HDPE.

[D.O.G]

I checked the difference between each plate on the first reactor they are 1.97 volts This is a little low, if the car is running, but OK.
on the second reactor they are 1.65volts. This is too low
When i connected the earth to the battery i couldnt get the reactor to work, hence i used the chasis as earth. That's really odd, something isn't right.

In regards to the cable size, 2.5mm is a bit small for the first reactor. With the second connected, it's way too small.

[aceras624]

whats this talk about "earth"?!?!? you understand that youre grounding to the battery/chassis right? not the actual earth??

[BioFarmer93]

whats this talk about "earth"?!?!? you understand that youre grounding to the battery/chassis right? not the actual earth??

Ace, the Brits say earth for ground, like we say gas for petrol or fries for chips, hood for bonnet etc..

[aceras624]

in that case how would the reactor not work when connected to the battery but work when connected to the chassis?!?!?

[BioFarmer93]

in that case how would the reactor not work when connected to the battery but work when connected to the chassis?!?!?

I think you just shook a neuron loose with that obvious but necessary question there, Ace... JIM- check your construction carefully, because based on that latest little jewel it sounds as if you have a short somewhere...

[Jamesleaper]

I think you just shook a neuron loose with that obvious but necessary question there, Ace... JIM- check your construction carefully, because based on that latest little jewel it sounds as if you have a short somewhere...

ok, i need a bit of help here, i dont understand what i should be looking for, a short being metal against metal, and are you thinking that i should be connecting the earth to the battery, are you thinking the plates are touching?!

[Jamesleaper]

I think you just shook a neuron loose with that obvious but necessary question there, Ace... JIM- check your construction carefully, because based on that latest little jewel it sounds as if you have a short somewhere...

ok just looked up short circuit, i was thinking, maybe the wire i am using is not heavy duty enough, perhaps i should increase from 2.5mm2 to 4mm2. what do you think?

[Madsceintist]

ok just looked up short circuit, i was thinking, maybe the wire i am using is not heavy duty enough, perhaps i should increase from 2.5mm2 to 4mm2. what do you think?


If I read correctly, your pulling 30 amps on 25 plates on a 2.5 mm wire. Yes or No ? Is this solid wire or braided? To thin of wire and you can "short" out a relay, switch, or any number of things that have the ability to build heat that can't get rid of it quickly. Upgrade your wire.

Just a thought, did you mistakenly bend or twist something when you were moving the wires?

[Jamesleaper]

If I read correctly, your pulling 30 amps on 25 plates on a 2.5 mm wire. Yes or No ? Is this solid wire or braided? To thin of wire and you can "short" out a relay, switch, or any number of things that have the ability to build heat that can't get rid of it quickly. Upgrade your wire.

Just a thought, did you mistakenly bend or twist something when you were moving the wires?

its solid wire, iam going to change the and see what that achieves.

[BioFarmer93]

ok, i need a bit of help here, i dont understand what i should be looking for, a short being metal against metal, and are you thinking that i should be connecting the earth to the battery, are you thinking the plates are touching?!

Jim,

-There is absolutely no reason that I can think of for the reactor to work properly when earthed to the chassis, but not when connected directly to the battery- it makes no sense. It is impossible. You have either overlooked something, or left a key fact out of your description/explanation. During the test it DID have electrolyte in it, didn't it? The short circuit possibility exists because not only are your gaskets only 1mm thick, so are your plates. At that small of a clearance, a virtually invisible warp in a plate would call the game.

[Madsceintist]

Jim,

-There is absolutely no reason that I can think of for the reactor to work properly when earthed to the chassis, but not when connected directly to the battery- it makes no sense. It is impossible. You have either overlooked something, or left a key fact out of your description/explanation. During the test it DID have electrolyte in it, didn't it? The short circuit possibility exists because not only are your gaskets only 1mm thick, so are your plates. At that small of a clearance, a virtually invisible warp in a plate would call the game.

HOLY HYDROGEN - BIO;
I neglected to read the part of 1 mm plates......... DUH.
J.leaper;
Your plates cant possibly be 1 mm! Are they? Gaskets okay, plates NO way!

[Madsceintist]

BIO;
I ran into a strange occurrence when I first started this journey. My reactor/generator didn't seem to work well at all without an ampmeter in line. Unlike my bench testing on a battery charger, that did work well. But on the car without a ampmeter it produced very little. With the ampmeter in line it produced large amounts.

J.leaper;
Do you have any thing on your generator or is it straight to the battery then grounded(chassis or battery). PWM ? Ampmeter? Something?

[Jamesleaper]

BIO;
I ran into a strange occurrence when I first started this journey. My reactor/generator didn't seem to work well at all without an ampmeter in line. Unlike my bench testing on a battery charger, that did work well. But on the car without a ampmeter it produced very little. With the ampmeter in line it produced large amounts.

J.leaper;
Do you have any thing on your generator or is it straight to the battery then grounded(chassis or battery). PWM ? Ampmeter? Something?

i added a PWM this build.I think the plates are 1.5mm thick. I will have to measure them.

[Jamesleaper]

Jim,

-There is absolutely no reason that I can think of for the reactor to work properly when earthed to the chassis, but not when connected directly to the battery- it makes no sense. It is impossible. You have either overlooked something, or left a key fact out of your description/explanation. During the test it DID have electrolyte in it, didn't it? The short circuit possibility exists because not only are your gaskets only 1mm thick, so are your plates. At that small of a clearance, a virtually invisible warp in a plate would call the game.

I agree so why is it working at all?!

Yes i used electrolyte, but i didn't measure quantities or volume of gas, it was more to see it work before fitting it. I am going to video the wiring and explain it, and see if you can see anything wrong with it, or suggest why it may not work.
thanks jim

[myoldyourgold]

BIO;
I ran into a strange occurrence when I first started this journey. My reactor/generator didn't seem to work well at all without an ampmeter in line. Unlike my bench testing on a battery charger, that did work well. But on the car without a ampmeter it produced very little. With the ampmeter in line it produced large amounts.

Msceintist, was you meter through a shunt or was it an all in one meter? Also was it connected on the - or + side? I might have an answer.

[BioFarmer93]

Mad,
-Don't make me say it!;):D The only thing an amp meter does is suck a bit of the current that's flowing through it, it's not in any way a contributor, only a detractor. I know you know this but I had to put that in for anyone reading this that thinks otherwise. In the case you described above there was another factor involved that you were either unaware of or inadvertently overlooked, because if an amp meter can somehow promote production then I'm gonna say thehellwithit and hang this nonsense up and just watch TV & eat.

[Madsceintist]

Mad,
-Don't make me say it!;):D The only thing an amp meter does is suck a bit of the current that's flowing through it, it's not in any way a contributor, only a detractor. I know you know this but I had to put that in for anyone reading this that thinks otherwise. In the case you described above there was another factor involved that you were either unaware of or inadvertently overlooked, because if an amp meter can somehow promote production then I'm gonna say thehellwithit and hang this nonsense up and just watch TV & eat.


:eek: I wasn't saying that the ampmeter was the contributor but I did have that issue as I said. ON THE CAR the only difference between making a little or alot was the ampmeter. ????? It was attached to the negative side and the reator grounded directly through the ampmeter. Didn't change water, didn't change or move the cell, just spliced one wire for the ampmeter. At that point (in history), I was using a heavy duty flasher for semi's to pulse the voltage(don't ask)! :eek:

Yeh, what the help...?


Sometimes when I have time and not enough money for my next theory, I just sit in front of the TV. Mostly I cant catch up on work to have either time or money.

[Madsceintist]

Msceintist, was you meter through a shunt or was it an all in one meter? Also was it connected on the - or + side? I might have an answer.

I used a SUNPRO CP7954 right out of the box. It was between the reactor and the chassis.

[myoldyourgold]

OK was there a PWM in use?

[Madsceintist]

OK was there a PWM in use?

At THAT time it was running- hot wire from the alternator- to the relay- to the reactor- to the ampmeter- to the ground. My reactor relay had its power on from my fuel pump relay, so as there would be no power to the reactor if the car wasn't actually running. Keep in mind these were the things that I started off with from my beginnings over a year ago. Much different now but it was a great start. I must say some of it has been mind numbing but over all its been fun and rewarding!

Also, NO there was little to no electronics as in PWM's. I wanted to keep it as simple as possible and play with the car more than the HHO. Just needed the right amount of HHO to make combustion.

[Jamesleaper]

Just bypassed the PWM, however havent changed wire size and took a reading on the ampmeter, no change, so increased amount of KOH, still no change on ampmeter.

Question, Is my wire size, (2.5mm2), controlling the amount of production?

im not an electric person, but with wire size i was always told to imagine a water pipe which will only allow a specific flow through any given diameter, so im thinking change the wire before it sets on fire!

correct me if im wrong, thanks, jim

[Madsceintist]

Just bypassed the PWM, however havent changed wire size and took a reading on the ampmeter, no change, so increased amount of KOH, still no change on ampmeter.

Question, Is my wire size, (2.5mm2), controlling the amount of production?

im not an electric person, but with wire size i was always told to imagine a water pipe which will only allow a specific flow through any given diameter, so im thinking change the wire before it sets on fire!

correct me if im wrong, thanks, jim

Are you saying there's no change in production with and without the PWM, or is there no difference without the PWM?
Also if your pulling to many amps with to small of a wire, you can melt the insulation off of it and cause a fire.

[aceras624]

seems like he'd notice the wires getting REALLY hot if lack of wire size was the issue

[D.O.G]

Just bypassed the PWM, however havent changed wire size and took a reading on the ampmeter, no change, so increased amount of KOH, still no change on ampmeter.

Question, Is my wire size, (2.5mm2), controlling the amount of production?

im not an electric person, but with wire size i was always told to imagine a water pipe which will only allow a specific flow through any given diameter, so im thinking change the wire before it sets on fire!

correct me if im wrong, thanks, jim

OK Jim,
You've told us the first reactor is 25 plates (4 stacks of 6 cells I guess) and has 1.97V across each plate. This equals 11.82V across each stack of the reactor. If that figure is with the car running (13.8V), you have about 2V voltage drop at this point.
You've told us the second reactor is 13 plates (2 stacks of 6 cells?) with 1.65V across each plate. This equals 9.9V across each stack of the reactor, giving you about 4V voltage drop at this point.
This is probably caused by drawing 24A (36mV on a 75mV/50A shunt) on 2.5mm cable and maybe a couple of hot joints.

If you run each reactor with 2.5mm back to the battery (no PWM) you would probably see much better production, even better with 4mm cable.
If you want to use the PWM, run 6mm cable as a minimum.

Ideally, you want to see no voltage drop at each stack of your reactors. I'd suggest you run the biggest cable you can fit and use the minimum number of joints that get the job done. You should see an increase in Amps drawn and LPM produced.

[Jamesleaper]

OK Jim,
You've told us the first reactor is 25 plates (4 stacks of 6 cells I guess) and has 1.97V across each plate. This equals 11.82V across each stack of the reactor. If that figure is with the car running (13.8V), you have about 2V voltage drop at this point.
You've told us the second reactor is 13 plates (2 stacks of 6 cells?) with 1.65V across each plate. This equals 9.9V across each stack of the reactor, giving you about 4V voltage drop at this point.
This is probably caused by drawing 24A (36mV on a 75mV/50A shunt) on 2.5mm cable and maybe a couple of hot joints.

If you run each reactor with 2.5mm back to the battery (no PWM) you would probably see much better production, even better with 4mm cable.
If you want to use the PWM, run 6mm cable as a minimum.

Ideally, you want to see no voltage drop at each stack of your reactors. I'd suggest you run the biggest cable you can fit and use the minimum number of joints that get the job done. You should see an increase in Amps drawn and LPM produced.

Question, i have earthed to the chasis and not the battery, and as yet have no negative connection at all to the battery, other than via the chasis, would a direct connection to the battery improve performance?

I am going to change all the wire to 6mm, and forget about PWM for now.

[BioFarmer93]

Question, i have earthed to the chasis and not the battery, and as yet have no negative connection at all to the battery, other than via the chasis, would a direct connection to the battery improve performance?

I am going to change all the wire to 6mm, and forget about PWM for now.

Jim,
-Impossible to do better than a direct connection to the battery..;)

[Madsceintist]

jim,
-impossible to do better than a direct connection to the battery..;)

Ditto............

[D.O.G]

Question, i have earthed to the chasis and not the battery, and as yet have no negative connection at all to the battery, other than via the chasis, would a direct connection to the battery improve performance?

I am going to change all the wire to 6mm, and forget about PWM for now.

Jim, I really can't understand why your reactor didn't work when the wiring was connected directly to the negative (earth) terminal of the battery the first time.:confused: That should be the better way of connecting it.

Obviously, connecting through the chassis works for you, I'm just concerned that it introduces a couple of extra joints that could be contributing to the voltage drop you are experiencing.

Just one other point (that you probably already know). Check that your fuse base and relay are rated (maximum continuous amps) for more that you actually expect to draw. Your shunt is good for 50A, your relay and fuse base should be about the same. Once again, this can help to remove a possible cause of voltage drop.

I hope this helps,
Pete.

[aceras624]

it seems to me that if you somehow have better results from grounding to the chassis, than when you grounded to the battery (which the chassis is grounded to) then you may have not grounded to the battery right. perhaps yoou didnt have a clean connection to the battery and then made a better connection when you grounded to the chassis?

[Jamesleaper]

Ok there is a series of videos to watch, unfortunately there isnt a pause button on my phone, hence a few videos.

Ive a question about the intercooler and my connection to the air intake, have a look at the long video, cant help thinking i should be connecting to the otherside of the engine, if so how?

http://youtu.be/KZTiC2UML44

http://youtu.be/KI-kGaUAgcw

http://youtu.be/kicZoX-WGC0

http://youtu.be/s7ke0g-w-uw

http://youtu.be/qUR01uOs6Ao

http://youtu.be/6PTEDqJdlyo

ok thanks for watching jim

[D.O.G]

Good videos Jim.

I'll leave the intercooler question for the other guys, I don't have any experience with diesels.

I'm glad to hear that your voltage readings are better. Yes, that was a lot of wire in the first install. Voltage drop is usually calculated by amps times wire resistance per metre, so the extra length was hurting you.

Your electrolyte measuring isn't quite right though. For a 20% concentration, you need 20% (1/5) of the total weight, not the weight of the water alone.
Weigh the water, divide by four, then add that weight of NaOH. That mix in the video was actually 16.7%.;)

[Jamesleaper]

Well drove 2 miles looked under the bonnet/hood and the fuse had blown, washed out mix and changed to water only, must be a lot of residue in the bottom of second rector. Measurents taken with just water 44mv on the shunt and 13.18 volts on rector one and 13 volts on second.


http://youtu.be/dLOX-OKGMMg

:confused:

[Madsceintist]

Jim;
I would like to straighten out the confusion on which side of the intercooler you should be using.
1; Because your not making more HHO and pumping it in under pressure then you must let it be sucked in on the VACUUM side(which is where you currently have it).
2; You don't usually want to have to go thru the cooler or long distances with HHO, but you don't have that option with your vehicle as the pressure would back feed your reactors and resevior.

Sorry for the earlier confusion.

[Jamesleaper]

Jim;
I would like to straighten out the confusion on which side of the intercooler you should be using.
1; Because your not making more HHO and pumping it in under pressure then you must let it be sucked in on the VACUUM side(which is where you currently have it).
2; You don't usually want to have to go thru the cooler or long distances with HHO, but you don't have that option with your vehicle as the pressure would back feed your reactors and resevior.

Sorry for the earlier confusion.

so are you saying that because i have an intercooler then it is more than likely i will not get the full benefit of HHO?

or, and i have to make more HHO than i have made so far, and if so how more LPM?roughly.

[D.O.G]

Well drove 2 miles looked under the bonnet/hood and the fuse had blown, washed out mix and changed to water only, must be a lot of residue in the bottom of second rector. Measurents taken with just water 44mv on the shunt and 13.18 volts on rector one and 13 volts on second.


http://youtu.be/dLOX-OKGMMg

:confused:

OK, in this situation you have two options, re-install the PWM to control your current, or mix your electrolyte weaker to lower your amp draw.
Personally, I like the second option, but many like being able to alter amp draw as conditions change with the minimum fuss by using a PWM.

You've gone with the second option for now, 44mV across your shunt = 29.3A.:D I wonder how high it was before the fuse let go with the strong mix.:eek:

I wouldn't worry about moving the inlet of the second reactor unless you have to tear it down for something else.

[Madsceintist]

so are you saying that because i have an intercooler then it is more than likely i will not get the full benefit of HHO?

or, and i have to make more HHO than i have made so far, and if so how more LPM?roughly.

No, I'm saying that because you don't produce enough to pressurize and inject under pressure you have to allow it to be sucked in by the vacuum! WHICH IS WHAT YOU ARE DOING.

As far as the quality of the HHO, the less time or length that it has to travel the better the quality, if you are producing good quality in the first place.

I personally think you have a contamination problem in one of you cells. Or a plate is warped, if you keep blowing fuses. You should check your voltage readings a little closer across each plate of each cell.