Plate Configuration issue

[Outmodeduser]

I have a 8 plate cell shown in the attached picture. I submerged it into purified water (a tad over a liter of water), and added .5 teaspoons of baking soda (I hear this isn't the best electrolyte, but I just wanted to make sure the plates were good). As soon as I completed the circuit with my car's battery, it seems like it shorted out. Sparks came out from the terminal which I connected to the battery, and the engine started to die down. Also, after I disconnected everything, the plates were room temp, but the bolts (also stainless steel) were hot. While I assume that means the cell was drawing a ton of Amps, I don't see why.
What am I doing wrong?

[lhazleton]

Well, if you have s/s washers between each plate, you're causing a dead short across everything. If you're intent on building a wet-cell (not recommended), you need to use nylon washers instead. Do some research before you get hurt.

[Outmodeduser]

Well, if you have s/s washers between each plate, you're causing a dead short across everything. If you're intent on building a wet-cell (not recommended), you need to use nylon washers instead. Do some research before you get hurt.

Thanks, that's what I thought. I'm building a wet cell because it seems like a good starting point. (For a newbie to this whole thing)

If the SS washers are causing a short across everything, would the bolts do the same? Would I have to connect an individual + and - wire to each plate before routing them all into a battery?

[BioFarmer93]

Thanks, that's what I thought. I'm building a wet cell because it seems like a good starting point. (For a newbie to this whole thing)

If the SS washers are causing a short across everything, would the bolts do the same? Would I have to connect an individual + and - wire to each plate before routing them all into a battery?

If you're just experimenting with wet cells for the time being, build it like this to see lots of bubbles...

[Outmodeduser]

If you're just experimenting with wet cells for the time being, build it like this to see lots of bubbles...

Thanks a bunch. I love how stupid I feel now that its visualized. That being said, I have 8 plates. I've read on this forum that other people new to this like I am are using a -nnn+nnn- configuration. Is there an advantage to this?

Oh, as I edit this, I would like to point out that this whole hydrogen cell project I am working on is a research methods project on weather or not you can see a increase in fuel efficiency in a vehicle from using a hydrogen cell. Obviously I am just getting started, and there is more to it. Is there any scientific studies that have been published about this that describe the process? Any reliable scientific sources that I could cite in my study?

[nst6563]

I'm with Lee on this one. If you're building a wet cell to see lots of bubbles produced, you can do the same with a bottle of 7-up and a mentos - with next to no danger involved. If you're really out for research to improve fuel economy you should skip to a dry cell. It's more efficient to begin with.

Everyone's gotta start somewhere though. Just be careful wherever you decide to start.

[Bhart]

Here are two sites to get you started on HHO:

http://www.panaceauniversity.org/Hydroxy%20Boosters.pdf
http://www.panaceauniversity.org/GEET%20fuel%20procesor.pdf

[lhazleton]

Gus>> Love the 'noobpic' diagram. Is this your newest project????????????? :p

[BioFarmer93]

Gus>> Love the 'noobpic' diagram. Is this your newest project????????????? :p

NO.... Ya knucklehead, to see my newest project go here...http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iioQ4kp8MNM :p

Actually, I think I did it for that Chris0147 character that you admire so much... You know, the one that got my hair.

[Outmodeduser]

I'm with Lee on this one. If you're building a wet cell to see lots of bubbles produced, you can do the same with a bottle of 7-up and a mentos - with next to no danger involved. If you're really out for research to improve fuel economy you should skip to a dry cell. It's more efficient to begin with.

Everyone's gotta start somewhere though. Just be careful wherever you decide to start.

I just figured that bubbles = hydrogen. Lots of bubbles = lots of hydrogen. Lots of hydrogen = good. I'm trying to be as careful as I can, but once school starts up again and I can get some lab time in a safe (not a three seasons porch workshop) environment.
How inefficient is a wet cell? Like "oh this is the worst thing ever" or "meh, this will do". I'm a bike mechanic, so when people say one crank is less efficient than the other, they are talking about weight, stiffness, and speed. But both do the job. Will a wet cell still be good enough for my research?

[BioFarmer93]

I just figured that bubbles = hydrogen. Lots of bubbles = lots of hydrogen. Lots of hydrogen = good. I'm trying to be as careful as I can, but once school starts up again and I can get some lab time in a safe (not a three seasons porch workshop) environment.
How inefficient is a wet cell? Like "oh this is the worst thing ever" or "meh, this will do". I'm a bike mechanic, so when people say one crank is less efficient than the other, they are talking about weight, stiffness, and speed. But both do the job. Will a wet cell still be good enough for my research?

In a word, no. If this is for a research paper then you will want the most efficiency & best output for the least input of electrical energy, right? Wet cells are less than half as efficient as dry cells, especially well thought out and well made dry cells.

[Outmodeduser]

So, I built and tested the wet cell shown in the picture, and well, guess what... it worked. Thanks guys, I look forward to tinkering with it and getting more output!

And Biofarmer93, I would love to build a dry cell, but I think for the time being (due to cost and time restrictions) I am going to just make the wet cell as efficient as possible. Its probably not perfect, but its a start.

Thanks for all your help, and I look forward to playing with my cell :p.

[myoldyourgold]

Oh, as I edit this, I would like to point out that this whole hydrogen cell project I am working on is a research methods project on weather or not you can see a increase in fuel efficiency in a vehicle from using a hydrogen cell. Obviously I am just getting started, and there is more to it. Is there any scientific studies that have been published about this that describe the process? Any reliable scientific sources that I could cite in my study?

By using an inefficient system you will see little to no results. The fact that you most likely will prove is that it takes more power to make the gas than you get in return. What are you going to test it on? A bike or a car? Most bikes produce so little current that you really need a very efficient reactor to get any gains. Some of the larger bikes have big enough alternators to spare a few amps.

[Outmodeduser]

By using an inefficient system you will see little to no results. The fact that you most likely will prove is that it takes more power to make the gas than you get in return. What are you going to test it on? A bike or a car? Most bikes produce so little current that you really need a very efficient reactor to get any gains. Some of the larger bikes have big enough alternators to spare a few amps.

I will be using it in a car. I work on bicycles, the ones where you pedal haha. I laughed at the idea of an HHO generator on one...

So, I already have my plates, hardware, and the like, what more do I need for a dry cell. I have pvc, but that was mainly for an enclosure. I am trying to keep costs as low as possible too...

If it requires basically hitting a reset button on everything I have bought/worked on so far, I am just to busy to do that.

[Outmodeduser]

So, I just did some quick research, and learned about current bleeding from the positive to negative through the water instead of the plates. Makes sense to me.
What if I were to insulate the edges of the plates, would that do anything?

[myoldyourgold]

So, I just did some quick research, and learned about current bleeding from the positive to negative through the water instead of the plates. Makes sense to me.
What if I were to insulate the edges of the plates, would that do anything?

Eureka!

The best way figured out to solve this problem to date is what is called a dry cell with Weld-on 16 insulating the ports. Well you are making head way. That is why we recommended you start there to begin with.