HHO Dry Cell Help

[mrbluemoose]

I would like some help on my dry cell. I have a 97 Plate all SS 316L and the Plates are sanded on both sides. the gaskets are made of shower pan gasket and I think its about a 1mm thick. the plates are 20 gauge and are in -nnnnn+
I would like to find out if this gap is ok. i have ran the same gap in -nnnn+ and made great hho but don't want to make steam . I loaded Some photos and one of old cell that I had about 90 amps going to on each side it had 2 sides of 42 plates at -nnnn+

[akabob]

180 Total amps? Play with the number of neutrals between + and - to lower your amps. I think between 5 and 7 neutral plates are best to reduce leakage. Also, try feeding only 90 amps at a connection in the middle of your cell. you probably are getting more steam the hho. With this big of system you can try cooling your water some how...

[mrbluemoose]

The Dry Cell I Had was putting out HHO and I would say over 10Lpm it was hho not steam had filled ballon and it filled fast and went up now this new cell is all SS and is as one with lose wires that old cell was hooked up before I know people say 2.4v between I would like to hear people input on what size pwm i should use or can i hook it up with out one

[BioFarmer93]

I would like some help on my dry cell. I have a 97 Plate all SS 316L and the Plates are sanded on both sides. the gaskets are made of shower pan gasket and I think its about a 1mm thick. the plates are 20 gauge and are in -nnnnn+
I would like to find out if this gap is ok. i have ran the same gap in -nnnn+ and made great hho but don't want to make steam . I loaded Some photos and one of old cell that I had about 90 amps going to on each side it had 2 sides of 42 plates at -nnnn+

Good morning MrBlueMoose,
I just quickly did a calculation based on a recent clarification about figuring current density. If I understand it correctly, you figure 1/2 of an amp per square inch of working (wet) plate area for one side only of all the plates in one stack. So, in your case it would be 6x6=36(sq.in.)x7(plates)=252(sq.in.)x.5(amps)=126 amps. Per a previous post of yours where you asked about running two 70A PWM's, I will say that is a good idea, but one thing will have to be done- a 1" HDPE divider needs to be between the two halves to electrically separate them. You don't want to smoke your PWM's. It will also give you a place to add gas & equalizer ports to serve each half of the unit. This is important, because with high plate count e-lyzers that have close plate spacing such as yours, it is just a fact that the inner plates starve somewhat for electrolyte and heat more than the outer plates.
Shower pan liner from H-D is .040" or 1.574mm. I have used it myself, one time. Never again. Heat and KOH is a combination that degrades certain elastic properties of that (soft) type of PVC sheet in a manner that allows you to use it for only one build. When you do your tear down, you'll have to trash them because they become brittle and warped. You could at this point go back to H-D in the garden dept. and get some black EPDM "pond liner". It's 15' wide on a big roll back there and the price is very reasonable. I say "at this point" because you absolutely need to pull your beautiful creation back apart and take all those plates and get them media blasted somewhere. Yeah, I know.... I had to do it too. I sanded first, THEN found out about the efficiency & area increase available from media blasting. It's looking real good moose-man, don't stumble now! Bite the bullet and get 'em blasted...

[myoldyourgold]

I suspect that the active surface area after subtracting out the gaskets, the ports, and upper dead area is closer to 25 square inches and that results in 100 amps max. The is going under the assumption that all 8 stacks are in series and not 2 sets running in parallel.

[mrbluemoose]

1st Thanks for the info. The Dry Cell that was in the photo I just built it from my old dry cell plus some new ones that made the Pos. & Neg. I did cut new Gaskets and sanded the plates again. is the surface of plates 6x6 do you - the gasket space witch is about 1/2 wide so its 5"x5" is this right. I would like to get more info I'm going to build a new dry cell in a week here .what kind of gasket is good and how thick.I also like to know how the pond liner works for you. P.s If i don't use pwm on this cell and get it control by how much koh i use maybe at 90 amps will this work the 70 amp pwm i have has hookup for wires like 14 gauge but 2 - in 2 - out to cell can this handle 70 amps thanks again

heres a link to my pwm if you can give me some feed back again thanks for your time
http://www.scribd.com/doc/6677634/Manual-35A-70A-100A-PWM-for-HHO-Hydrogen

[mrbluemoose]

I also want to let you know I'm Pumping Water into the cell at both ends will this help the middle plats from starving and heating up thanks

[BioFarmer93]

Hey Moose,
70A gets 4ga. wire at under the hood temperatures.

Yes the water pumping will help.

Yes, 5"x5" is right, I don't know why but I always think that people are
talking about active area, not the actual size of the plate. My fault.

The pond liner is black EPDM and is one of the best materials for HHO gaskets that you can use. There are some materials that are better, but I know of no complaints about the EPDM, the price is right, and it is available at home improvement stores.

Moose, you HAVE to start using punctuation and capital letters to let us know when you are starting a new sentence. I am not really sure I understood your last question, but I think I did... go to this link-

http://wiki.xtronics.com/index.php/Wire-Gauge_Ampacity

-and you can find what size wire you need for different amperages.

P.S.- Es el español su lengua materna?
Si es asÃ*, entonces creo que puede haber confundido "lijar" con "chorro de arena", que se realiza con aire comprimido que sopla la arena de una boquilla.

[mrbluemoose]

The 70 amp PWM has two ground connections in and two out to cell only can put 14 gauge wire into connections it can't take a 2 gauge wire. :)

[BioFarmer93]

The 70 amp PWM has two ground connections in and two out to cell only can put 14 gauge wire into connections it can't take a 2 gauge wire. :)

-4 gauge.. But the point is moot, since the connection can only handle 14ga. I can't help but wonder about the integrity of the rest of the PWM's construction if they didn't bother to size the connectors properly for the declared output. At almost 1kW DC, you (they) need to be cognizant of conductor sizing, because not everyone is going to have their PWM within 12" of their reactors. So, what are you going to do? 14ga. is freakin' lampcord, and hardly applicable for the amps that monster will be pulling.

[mrbluemoose]

I have the dry cell installed into the truck. I have the dry cell hook to the Pos. with 2 gauge and neg. also with 2 gauge. the cell is pulling about 80 amps. the efie I hook up front o2 's are at 150 mv and back o2's are at 180 mv. the truck runs great and looking for some feed back on miles. I have uploaded some photos

[hhoconnection]

That is one clean install, good job!

[mrbluemoose]

I have a video of my install into my truck.
The efie I have installed works good.

I need to know if to fix the maf or the map, i read the maf 1st if anyone knows, please let me know

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IlJEEIGNl-0

[BioFarmer93]

Extraordinarily good work and hyper slick install, looks like a factory job except for color. You REALLY shoehorned that thing in there! Were there any hoses or pieces that had to be rerouted to get that fit?

[lhazleton]

Really great install! Nice and neat, everything powder-coated. I'll never post anymore video's of my work ever again!:D

[mrbluemoose]

I did not have to move anything to get it to fit. I had it made to fit. There is a water tank not in video under the truck and a water pump that feeds the Dry cell. I have one more dry cell being made ,it will be here in two weeks