Ways to increase MMW...

[BeaverRat]

Hello,
I am looking for ways of increasing my MMW of my lowes plate dry cell. As of now, here are some of my results.

Voltage:12
Amps:30
Volts/plate:2.35
ML:500
Seconds:19
LPM:1.58
MMW:4.39

Voltage:12
Amps:18
Volts/plate:2.35
ML:500
Seconds:30
LPM:1
MMW:4.63

Any ideas?

[lhazleton]

To increase your MMW, you'll need to add more bipolar plates.
Just out of curiosity, how are you arriving at your MMW numbers?
Something just doesn't add up.

[BeaverRat]

I used a mmw calculator. I will do some more flow tests today and get new data. I'm also thinking it could be my connectors, because they are getting burning hot, which means energy is being wasted.

[BeaverRat]

Ok, I just read all of the "Painless Experiment in HHO" thread and he was getting much better results than me with the same cell. I am running 2.35 volts per gap and so was he, and with the exact same 21 plate cell configured as: -NNNN+NNNN-NNNN+NNNN- he was able to achieve an mmw of 4.7 and I am actually at 4.1 right now. Here is the page where he says this...

http://www.hhoforums.com/showthread.php?t=771&page=20

Any ideas why this is? Here are some of my thoughts:

-my wires/connectors are getting hot (could be wastefull, but to what extent?)
-I might have some gas leaks

Pretty much the only difference between his cell and mine are my reservoir, hose connections, and wiring... We are both using 1/4 inch hose...

[BeaverRat]

BREAKTHROUGH!

I just re-measured in between plates voltage and it is at 2.9! That is way too much. With a gap of 2.9 volts, that would lower my mmw versus a gap of 2 volts, correct? All I need to do is add one more N plate...

[Danger]

If your wires are heating up, try using a higher gauge (lower number) wire to resolve that issue.

[lhazleton]

You need to add at least one more bi-polar plate per stack.
What is the surface area of one side of one plate within the gasket area?

[BeaverRat]

So would having a gap of 2.9 volts vs 2 volts decrease my mmw?

[lhazleton]

Of course. Like I asked before, what is the active area of one side of one plate?

[BeaverRat]

Ok, I added one more N plate for a total of four now. It is wired as follows:
-NNNN+NNNN-NNNN+NNNN-NNNN+ (25 plates). It is pulling 17 amps when warmed up and is producing 1 LPM. This is very good! I am using a 12 volt atx PSU so that is why I am doing 4 neutrals instead of 5 because I am running at 12 volts, not 13.8.

Voltage: Roughly 12 (PSU fluctuates by .2 volts)
Voltage per gap: 2.3
Amps: 17
Seconds: 60
Liters: 1.00
LPM: 1.00
MMW: 4.90

I would say that is pretty good with only 25 switchplate covers! Im gonna bring it up to 30 amps tommorow and see how we do!

Oh, and there is a active area per side of plate of 6.48 inches (There are 25 plates total, so (6.48x2x23)+(6.48x2)=311.04 total square inches.

[lhazleton]

That looks better. However, your current density is still a little high (.52A/sq.in.). It should never be over .5A. If you increase the apmerage to 30, your current density is going to shoot up to .93A/sq.in., thus losing efficiency.

[BeaverRat]

So right now at 15 amps it is at the best MMW it can be at? I noticed that if I add another N plate the voltage / gap is at 1.9 and it will only draw about 5 amps max, so I guess I have achieved the best that is possible with my lowes dry cell! I will get a video of it running today...

Oh, by the way, I searched around here and discovered that back in 2008 there was a guy named Painless that did the same thing with the lowes swithplate covers. With the exact same setup as me he was able to achieve a pretty good MMW even at higher amps...

http://www.hhoforums.com/showthread.php?t=771&highlight=painless+experiment&page=30

[lhazleton]

Yeah, Painless has been doing this for quite a while now.
As far as your performance is concerned, remember that you're only using 12vdc.
In a car, it'll be getting 13.8vdc. BIG difference!

[BeaverRat]

But... I have no plans to put this in my car- it will allways be running off of 12 volts, thats why I only have 4 N plates because of the lower (12 volts) input to the cell. Right now I am at about 10% NaOh and it is pulling around 20 amps and producing a bit over 1 LPM. I plan to raise it up to 28% solution tommorow by making an electrolyte mix of 1.25 pounds per half gallon (Is that correct?). I am very happy with this cell so far!

[lhazleton]

That's the correct mix for KOH, not NaOH.

[BeaverRat]

Ok, whats the correct pounds/gallon of water of NaOh?

[hhoconnection]

With 5 neutrals on my EBN dry cells I run about 3 tablespoons of NaOH in just under one gallon of water.