Don't bubblers need to be able to blow apart?

[jerryrig]

Okay, everyone is going to kill me, but I can not get over this bubbler wall.....I thought they were suposed to be able to have some sort of a blow out feature, in case of a back fire they can just blow apart....is that right?:confused:

I do have a in line water filter housing I could use for a bubller, I would have to seal the lid where I drilled a few holes. But nothing major. But still, I thought they were supposed to be able to blow apart or have some sort of a feature that will let the fall apart in case of back fire and explosion, that way it does not build up pressure if there is a series of backfires. Still confused.

[Stratous]

The bubbler doesnt need to blow apart. All it needs to do is prevent the flashback from making it to the generator. It also filters the gasses as they pass through the water.

[cougar gt-e]

The bubbler doesnt need to blow apart. All it needs to do is prevent the flashback from making it to the generator. It also filters the gasses as they pass through the water.

Ehhhhh, I'm sort of with Jerry on this one. Still a green horn newbee but the stories of "bangs!" get's my attention. I was thinking about 2 tubes of PVC one inside the other with 1 or 2 O-rings keeping them water tight and together. Gease the small tube a bit and slide them together. Should be able to find some with a snug friction fit that would easily blow apart if a backfire happens.


Probably not required 99.999999% of the time, but that one time, it would possibly be nice!

[Stratous]

you should make the bubbler strong enough to handle the flash back. If your running a large bubbler, then perhaps you do need it to blow apart, but I dont see the need for a large bubbler. Why on earth would you want your bubbler to blow apart? So it can damage your vehicle? Make the bubbler small and strong and it will contain a flashback if it ever occurs. The purpose of the bubbler is mostly to prevent a flashback from happening in your generator, secondary function is to filter the gas as it passes through the water. It doesnt need to be large to do that.

[Stratous]

Ehhhhh, I'm sort of with Jerry on this one. Still a green horn newbee but the stories of "bangs!" get's my attention. I was thinking about 2 tubes of PVC one inside the other with 1 or 2 O-rings keeping them water tight and together. Gease the small tube a bit and slide them together. Should be able to find some with a snug friction fit that would easily blow apart if a backfire happens.


Probably not required 99.999999% of the time, but that one time, it would possibly be nice!

I am really not understanding the logic here. Why does it need to come apart. The backflash cant travel through the water, thats the purpose of the water.

[jerryrig]

See, this is kind of what I am talking about. I am not the only nutty one. Tonight I will go to the shop and make my bubbler with my water filter housing. I might do that later if I get time. Glad I asked, it was really hard to make one. <object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/9zJJhe93540&hl=en&fs=1"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/9zJJhe93540&hl=en&fs=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>

[Stratous]

I still am not seeing the need for one that comes apart. If you build a stout bubbler why does it need to come apart? Imagine that bubbler coming apart in your engine compartment while your driving down the road? I suppose it wont hurt to build it that way, I am just not understaniding why its needed.

[Painless]

From what I've been reading, the best plan for the bubbler is for it to have a cap type lid that can be forced off by the explosion if the HHO above the bubblers water should ever be ignited. The idea of this is that the explosive force is spent pushing the cap off, rather than blowing the bubbler itself to bits, effectively robbing the explosion of any force.

This certainly makes sense to me as a safety precaution, however unlikely it is to occur.

Just my 2 cents :)

[HYDROTEKPRO]

Yeah, that's the deal. If you have a blow-off type lid like in the video, or a comparable mechanism, that's what you want.

Didn't the gas input line break in that video?

[cougar gt-e]

I still am not seeing the need for one that comes apart. If you build a stout bubbler why does it need to come apart? Imagine that bubbler coming apart in your engine compartment while your driving down the road? I suppose it wont hurt to build it that way, I am just not understaniding why its needed.

In 'Nam it would rain. (and rain and rain and rain). The boys would take a claymore mine apart and light the C4 explosive to start a fire. Worked good. No danger as the stuff just burns when not confined. But confine it and the pressure builds up strong enough to go "Boom@!". Same deal with explosion protection, make things that come apart with low pressure so they don't build up to high (Deadly) pressure.

Still, not required 99.999999% of the time, but that one time in a million....

[Omega]

Zero Fossil Fuel has a video on YouTube that shows a generator with a fitting coming out the top that he uses to allow a membrane to blow out instead of blowing the generator apart.

(They use these in industrial applications on tanks and so forth; they are called "rupture discs". The idea is to blow the replaceable (cheap) disc rather than blow up the tank.)

The membrane is just very thin plastic (like poly bag material) that is held in place by a slip fit ring over the base fitting. It's very simple and effective.

I would rather replace a piece of poly bag material than a bubbler assembly. My next generator and bubbler will have a "rupture disc" to prevent catastrophic failure.

Hey! I found the video!! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GWpdtC6TJ8k&feature=PlayList&p=EC45A0B872438E4A&index=14

Check it out!

[Stratous]

In the first video, the gas line ruptured before the cap blew off. I have had a flashback in my bubbler. I talked about this in another thread. I was using a dc powered vacuum pump and the spark from the dc motor ignited the HHO. It blew the crap out of my vacuum pump, but the bubbler survived just fine. It didnt even tip the bubbler over. I dont think the hose even came off the bubbler, though honestly, I could be wrong as it scared the beejesus outta me, so I may have missed that part. I spent a few hours trying to put the vacuum pump back together to no avail, it blew the diaphram inside the pump housing. The bubbler i use is small in comparison to my generator, normally the bubbler is only 2"x2"x8", so its not holding alot of HHO. Its made of 3/8" polycarbonate and is very strong.

[dennyk159]

Stratous
If your bubbler had been designed to come apart, could that have possibly saved your vacuum pump? I am using a plumber's test plug in the top of my bubbler, & one time I had the output of the bubbler going into a 5 gallon bucket of water to test flow. I thought it'd be cool to light those bubbles coming from what could be termed a secondary bubbler. I was getting lots of loud bangs, & the blasts were actually splashing water. Until my hose drifted to the top of the water level, & I hadn't noticed. Then it ignited all the way back to the bubbler, easily blowing the test plug out, & I'm not sure how high it went, but it took me awhile to find it 40 feet away in the yard. I think there was enough force that if it had been contained, it may have disentegrated my bubbler. It's 2" PVC, shown in pic...

[Omega]

Stratous
If your bubbler had been designed to come apart, could that have possibly saved your vacuum pump? I am using a plumber's test plug in the top of my bubbler, & one time I had the output of the bubbler going into a 5 gallon bucket of water to test flow. I thought it'd be cool to light those bubbles coming from what could be termed a secondary bubbler. I was getting lots of loud bangs, & the blasts were actually splashing water. Until my hose drifted to the top of the water level, & I hadn't noticed. Then it ignited all the way back to the bubbler, easily blowing the test plug out, & I'm not sure how high it went, but it took me awhile to find it 40 feet away in the yard. I think there was enough force that if it had been contained, it may have disentegrated my bubbler. It's 2" PVC, shown in pic...

Hey dennyk159, where did you get that top on the bubbler? That would be a great one to use on PVC enclosures of almost any size and eliminate some of the hassles of a threaded cap.

Let us know, that's too cool!!! :)

[dennyk159]

This one came from Lowe's, & was located amongst the PVC fittings. One thing about it though... when I switched from baking soda to NaOH, the rubber that gets squeezed to make the seal must have shrunk, because I ran out of thread to keep it tight. I ended up cutting the insides of the red ends so i would have more "squeeze space." Then that eventually ran out too. I have since bought a new one...

One other thing I like about it is it says "Stand clear while in use" around the top. See pic... I also saw these in a metal version at Home Depot. I like the red plastic ones better.

[dennis13030]

Zero Fossil Fuel has a video on YouTube that shows a generator with a fitting coming out the top that he uses to allow a membrane to blow out instead of blowing the generator apart.

(They use these in industrial applications on tanks and so forth; they are called "rupture discs". The idea is to blow the replaceable (cheap) disc rather than blow up the tank.)

The membrane is just very thin plastic (like poly bag material) that is held in place by a slip fit ring over the base fitting. It's very simple and effective.

I would rather replace a piece of poly bag material than a bubbler assembly. My next generator and bubbler will have a "rupture disc" to prevent catastrophic failure.

Hey! I found the video!! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GWpdtC6TJ8k&feature=PlayList&p=EC45A0B872438E4A&index=14

Check it out!

I really like the idea of the "rupture disc" too. I'd put on my electrolyzer case and forgo the bubbler for a flame arrestor.

[cjdave]

Remember the weakest link will go to pieces in a flash back. Make it the bubbler!

[RoadKill]

I too have a 2" pvc bubbler, what i did was take a 2" rubber jim cap (aka a quik cap) drilled out the center top with a hole saw, cut a circle of plexi glass and bonded it into the cap with silicone. now i can see into the bubbler if needed without removing the cap. Also the soft cap will pop right off in the event of a backflash (i keep the SS clamp loose).

[mstewart1982]

ive seen a bubbler built with a deflated balloon, attached to the top of the bubbler near the exit tube, that is used to absorb the expansion of the gases when ignited. balloon doesnt inflate full of hydroxy, because its escaping through the exit pipe.