some questions i have not seen addressed

[d3vilman]

i am now going to use this thread as my main discussion board. all my comments, concerns and questions will be posted here

1. a lot of people are using 316 stainless plates. I have access to sheets of 321 stainless (from what I know the only dif. is the heat treating process). The only thing is no one addresses the thickness of the plates.

2. I have been kicking around the idea of getting a cell from http://www.socal-fuelfromh2o.com/hhogenerators.php from what I understand from them along with some others is since I have a '94 full size Blazer and I should not have issues with my O2 sensor. These problems are accruing in vehicles 96 and newer.

3. The cell from fuelfromh20 is 5.625x5.625 x 3.5 so I am assuming the plates they are using are about 5x5. Does the size of the plate and the thickness make a big difference? I assume the bigger the plates are the less number of plates you need.

4. There have been many posts about the way to wire the cell and the number of n plates between the + and - plates. But there are some people that use no n plates and alternate the + and - plates. Have any of you tried this? And if so what where the results.

5. I have a 5.7L TBI, what would the best output from the cell be for an engine this size?

[d3vilman]

ok so people are reading this but not responding. i know these may be simple "newbee" questions but i am not finding the info els where. if someone has a link or what not to guide me in the right direction then please help. remember for all of you that know this info and where to find it you where once like me... looking for guidance.

[offroadgearhead]

The first cell that I built in my garage was one in which I arranged the plates with no neutrals, (only + - + - + - + -). The downside was that the amprage draw was WAY too high to consider putting in my F150. I'm not sure about your specific vehicle, but most trucks can handle 30 - 40A without much strain on the alt. If you go too far over this, you will end up replacing your alternator every 10,000 miles or so, and you've killed any fuel savings you may get. The neutral plates help to give the same surface area without too much amperage.

From what I understand about O2 sensors, ANY vehicle with O2 sensors will need some sort of modification. O2 sensors detect unburnt O2 in the exhaust signaling the computer that the mixture is too lean. The engine then adjust the fuel air mixture to be richer. This is great for power, but is the opposite of what you want if you are to save gas. If I am wrong on this, someone please let me know.

As for the plates, I have no Idea.

[d3vilman]

One thing I am reading that I understand to be a problem with these systems is that they don’t out put enough gas to be effective. Has anyone thought about putting in a Capacitor and or amplifier so you can pump more power to the cell without killing your alternator? They are used with the booming car stereos so they don’t kill the battery and don’t over whelm the altenator. Would something like this be possible?

[d3vilman]

i have seen many of the videos bb smack has on the net and i even watched most of the booster rally videos. i was not impressed with the fule economey that he was reporting but he was useing a wet cell and not one of his newer dry cells. i have the pdf of his dry cell and i am looking at starting my construction next week but... the LPM is my biggest consern. i am looking to push at least 5 LMP from the cell and stay under the 30 amps. right now from the video of the bb smack gen 4 i can get 1 LPM per 10 amps, there inlies the problem. if anyone has sugestions or other input then please let me know.

[d3vilman]

A lot of people are using 316 ss “316L is an extra low carbon (ELC) grade of stainless that has only .03% carbon, making less carbon available to precipitate with the chromium. It is used extensively in marine exhausts where salt water corrosion mixed with diesel exhaust particulates and electrolysis create such a horrible environment that even other grades of stainless cower and run away!´(just so you know)
Now I have access to sheets of 6*12 or bigger of the 321 ss “321 and 347 are known as stabilized grades of stainless. These are alloyed with either titanium (321) or columbium (347), both of which have a much stronger affinity for carbon than does chromium at elevated temperatures. This eliminates carbide precipitation leaving the chromium where it belongs for corrosion protection...remember our discussion of intergranular corrosion? Both 321 and 347 are top choices for exhaust headers, especially turbocharger systems and rotary engines. Since 321 is much more available than 347, that leaves 321 as the first choice, with no sacrifice in needed qualities” (just so you now)
Will this be an issue? With the 321 being alloyed with titanium it should last longer and not corrode as fast right? Now again the ss I have access to is about a 16th on an inch think is this too much or does it really matter?
Here are some links that give a breakdown of chemical break down of both the 316 and the 321 ss, so you brains out there that know more about metal and corrosion then I do may able to tell me what would be the best to go with.
I an in the Navy and have access to a full machine shop, solder shop, metal shop, weld shop, micro electronics, and even a composite shop. I have lots of time on my hands and want to get crack’n on screwing the man out of money and building a bad ass cell.

http://www.sandmeyersteel.com/321-321H.html
http://www.sandmeyersteel.com/316-316L.html

[d3vilman]

Below is a link so you can better understand what i am saying.. i think that some of the issues people are having are the ways they are injecting the HHO gas. if you have a stock air intake your air/fuel mix is not as good as it should be. now it has been subjected for those that have an air box that you can inject the hho into the box and the filter will help with the mixture of the hho and your air before it gets to the point that it mixes with the fuel. if that idea is correct than if i set up my hho to vent into the valleys of the filter would this have the same affect. i want to place my hho injector at the best place to maximize my fuel/air/hho mix. My first thought was to inject the hho just after the filter. then if you look at the pic i was thinking of injecting the hho in the dip in the housing just above the TBI. the prime spot would be in the center of the cone but i am not drilling into my filter i will drill in the housing i have a spare one. Either way i want to plum something like this (http://www.grainger.com/Grainger/items/1EJT6?BaseItem=1A326) so break up the hho to better blend witht eh air.

what do you guys thing

http://www.knfilters.com/images/l/57-3026.jpg

[biggy boy]

I'm not sure exactly were you are planning on tying in?
after the filter? somewhere in the black tube?
and where does the fitting you linked to go? will it create back pressure?


Glen

[d3vilman]

i hope this better explains what i was trying to say

1291

[d3vilman]

and where does the fitting you linked to go? will it create back pressure?

I do not think it will cause any back pressure. i have a few ideas about where i could put this in the system. i think i will incorporate it in the bubbler but i am looking at a way to pressurize my system still doing research on it. i want to use this part in place of the bubble stone people are using from wal-mart or where ever. it will last longer and i am hoping to break the hho into the smallest bubbles i can. Ultimately getting a better fuel air mix.

[Roland Jacques]

One thing I am reading that I understand to be a problem with these systems is that they don’t out put enough gas to be effective. Has anyone thought about putting in a Capacitor and or amplifier so you can pump more power to the cell without killing your alternator? They are used with the booming car stereos so they don’t kill the battery and don’t over whelm the altenator. Would something like this be possible?

Capacitors are for current surges, these cells are relitivly constant, a cap would not help anything.

.5 LPM of HHO, per 1 litter of Engine displacement is good IMO. Others think 1to 1 is better. i buy a cell tat can do 1 to 1 and lower the output.