Thoughts on injecting ONLY H2 as booster

[Philldpapill]

Has anyone ever tried using ONLY H2 gas as their booster, rather than 2H2/O2 mixture? I'm building a type of cell that produces the gases, but keeps them seperated. I'm thinking about designing some mechanisms for venting the oxygen so that a constant stream of H2 is available.

My thinking on this, is that there won't be any "fooling" of the O2 sensor involved. As the H2 comes in, the ECU should cut back on the fuel a little bit since the exhaust would be oxygen deprived due to the non-stochiometric input of just the H2.

What are your thoughts?

[TONY BRUNO]

Good idea...no oxygen to worry about

[Philldpapill]

Tony, I have no idea what you're talking about.

Shane, ha-ha.

Has anyone played around with this?

[oicu812]

a simple way to produce pure h2 is to make a extreamly strong batch of naoh and water and put it in an ultrasonic humidifier. get some powdered aluminium and force the mist through the aluminium its easy to control the reaction that way. run the gas through a couple bubblers . with just two ounces of powdered aluminium you can produce over 65 litres of pure h2. we used this method this year at the 4th of july to fill up h2 ballons. I ended up putting a lot of ice in the bubblers to get rid of any traces of water.

[Q-Hack!]

a simple way to produce pure h2 is to make a extreamly strong batch of naoh and water and put it in an ultrasonic humidifier. get some powdered aluminium and force the mist through the aluminium its easy to control the reaction that way. run the gas through a couple bubblers . with just two ounces of powdered aluminium you can produce over 65 litres of pure h2. we used this method this year at the 4th of july to fill up h2 ballons. I ended up putting a lot of ice in the bubblers to get rid of any traces of water.

This would work as long as the piezoelectric device that buzzes the water is not made of aluminium. :D

[oicu812]

This would work as long as the piezoelectric device that buzzes the water is not made of aluminium. :Dno the water goes in a removable resevoir and the resevoir sits in a cradle so the peizo never actually gets wet. you can buy them at target for $45 bucks.

[Q-Hack!]

no the water goes in a removable resevoir and the resevoir sits in a cradle so the peizo never actually gets wet. you can buy them at target for $45 bucks.

Err... not sure what design you have, but both of the humidifiers I have trickle water onto the peizo in order to mist it. If your water doesn't hit the peizo, how does it mist?

[oicu812]

go to target and buy one so you can see for yourself, the peizo is sealed.

[Q-Hack!]

go to target and buy one so you can see for yourself, the peizo is sealed.

You have peeked my interest... you got a model number? Target.com shows about 7 different models.

[Philldpapill]

Shane, I know what you meant. I've seen a few posts on this forum, and other sites about using urine to produce hydrogen(from the Urea in it).

This post is intended to discuss the USE of pure hydrogen in the engine, and not so much HOW to produce it. I know there are plenty of novelty ways of producing hydrogen, but that's another discussion entirely.

[oicu812]

You have peeked my interest... you got a model number? Target.com shows about 7 different models. i've been using the holmes HM500 ultrasonic cool mist humidifier with an extreamly strong mix of naoh for over six months with no problems. it does have a exposed tranducer in the base that gets wet but its totally uneffected by naoh. not sure what its made of. I was gonna try and patent this process using a powderd aluminium cartridge but a mist of caustic soda is simply to dangerous for the general public. if the mist got in your eyes you'ld be blind and if you were to breath in the mist you'ld be dead
the mist coming from the humidifier has no preasure behind it so I had to add a diaphram pump to force the mist through the aluminium powder.

[Q-Hack!]

i've been using the holmes HM500 ultrasonic cool mist humidifier with an extreamly strong mix of naoh for over six months with no problems. it does have a exposed tranducer in the base that gets wet but its totally uneffected by naoh. not sure what its made of. I was gonna try and patent this process using a powderd aluminium cartridge but a mist of caustic soda is simply to dangerous for the general public. if the mist got in your eyes you'ld be blind and if you were to breath in the mist you'ld be dead
the mist coming from the humidifier has no preasure behind it so I had to add a diaphram pump to force the mist through the aluminium powder.

Oof... Please be careful! Also remember that reaction will be thermobaric, so make sure that your mixing container can handle it.

[oicu812]

no problems so far, i'm using a 1 inch brass nipple 4 inches long with reducers down to 3/8 hose barbs on each end. puts out an enormous amount of pure h2. pure h2 burns much less violent than hho.

[gasmaker]

If that doesn't work, **** on it.

[Philldpapill]

pure h2 burns much less violent than hho.

oicu, hho is a stoichiometric combination of H2 and O2. "We" refer to it as HHO simply to distinguish it from H2 gas alone.

Because of that, I don't know what you mean by H2 burning less violently than hho... pure H2 doesn't burn because there is no oxygen. I don't mean to sound condecending - your statement is inaccurate and spreads ignorance about hho. hho isn't a magic gas, but just a stoichiometric mixture.

[oicu812]

phill... I can understand your ignorance on this subject because you've probebly never burned pure h2 before. i've been igniting hho in torches for years now and filling balloons with hho and igniting them. i've also done extensive testing with hho and plasma arc. trust me hho explodes violently . pure h2 on the otherhand will light from the torch tip after its exposed to air. if you fill a balloon with pure h2 and light the balloon it will burn but dosent explode violently. don't take my word for it see for yourself . get a piece of aluminium foil and cut it up into a bunch of tiny pieces. find a suitable container( IT GETS REALLY HOT) and put the aluminium in it. now carefully wearing eye protection and gloves pour a little bit of strong naoh and water mix into the container. after about 30 seconds you'll see violent bubbling and steam and pure h2 coming out. now grab a barbacue lighter and light the bubbles you'll find pure h2 does burn as long as its exposed to air. remember the hindenburg phill? yep, that was pure h2 burning once it was exposed to air. watch the old videos of the tragedy, you'll see it took well over a minute to burn and didn't explode violently like hho. if the hindenburg was filled with hho it would have been an unbeilivable violent explosion quite possibly killing thousands of people on the ground also. now phill I don't mean to sound condecending but it seams you are the one spreading ignorance. I don't even know why I tried to help you out, you seam like a total duece bag.

[Philldpapill]

oicu, you just reiterated exactly what I said. "hho" has the highest energy potential because it's a stoichiometric ratio of H2 and O2. For every O2 molecule, there are two H2 molecules. Pure H2, on the other hand doesn't burn because there is NO O2 present(you have to expose it to "air"). EXACTLY WHAT I SAID.

As far as spreading ignorance, I stand by that. When someone talks or writes in ways that attach some sort of mysticism to "hho", yes, they are spreading ignorance. hho is NOT special, other than it being a perfect ratio of H2 and O2 due to the process of making it(electrolysis). For the reputation of the hho community, STOP IT WITH THE CONSPIRACY ATTITUDE LIKE I'VE SEEN YOU DO IN OTHER POSTS. It makes ALL of us, who are doing legitimate research, look like a bunch of bumbling, barbeque lighter weilding, idiots.

Also, stop getting this off topic. This thread isn't about MAKING H2. I stated that I've already made a rig to capture it just fine. This was meant to be about USING H2 vs. hho.

[oicu812]

my post was trying to help you create masive amounts of h2 to direct directly into the intake, and all you did was insult me telling me I don't know the difference between hho and h2 and saying I was spreading ignorance. how much pure h2 are you able to produce with your setup? mine makes ten litres a minute of pure h2 with zero oxygen . it uses a tiny amount of current to run the humidifier and diaghram pump. if you don't want my help fine, but the insults you can lose.

[Philldpapill]

I wasn't asking HOW to make H2, I was asking what RESULTS people have had by using it. Your method may make copious amounts of H2, but it is unsustainable as the aluminum is used up. Using electrolysis to capture H2 from water is sustainable. As far as the amount that's produced - it doesn't matter. What matters is the efficiency of production. Any process can be scaled up to meet a quantity demand, but it's efficiency that's the bottom line.

And no, I don't think you understand the difference between "hho" and H2.

[hhonewbie]

my post was trying to help you create masive amounts of h2 to direct directly into the intake. mine makes ten litres a minute of pure h2 with zero oxygen . it uses a tiny amount of current to run the humidifier and diaghram pump.

10 LPM pure h2 direct into the intake sounds awsome. Im interested, are you willing to share your info gen/cell material/design drycell or wetcell do you have any pics?

[oicu812]

10 LPM pure h2 direct into the intake sounds awsome. Im interested, are you willing to share your info gen/cell material/design drycell or wetcell do you have any pics?no problem, i'm at work now but tommorrow i'll pm you the setup.

[Roland Jacques]

10 LPM pure h2 direct into the intake sounds awsome. Im interested, are you willing to share your info gen/cell material/design drycell or wetcell do you have any pics?
Dito, sounds interesting :)

[oicu812]

hhonewbie and Roland you've got PM. and sorry Phillthepill, you are such a complete Fu&king A$$hole i'll have nothing to do with you.

[Roland Jacques]

Just a thought on your original question.

It seems that folks still think that if you just use H2 without O2 that you would not have o2 sensor issues. I dont think this is the case at all.

Many folks have tried that, i dont know of any who still did not have O2 sensor issues.

1st, Remember for H2 to burn it Needs O2. So what we add in O2, (1 molecule of O2 for each 2 molecule of H2) is not even enough O2 to match the full requirements for complete combustion of the H2 we are adding.

2nd, such a small amount of O2 that we are adding represents less than 1% of the O2 that is in the air taking in by the motor.
I've seen Youtube videos where folks introduce 2 LMP of straight O2 into the exhaust manifold while the engine is running and the O2 sensor did not even register any addtional O2 on that particular car. We see O2 sensor register even as little as 0.3 LPM HHO being introduced into the intake. which is hardly any O2 at all compared to the total intake. So IMO i dont think the O2 has anything to do with what are O2 sensors are reading when adding HHO.

[Philldpapill]

oicu, you can call me all the names you want.

In my defense, I'd rather be an F'ing A-hole than someone who spreads BS about over unity and various other moronic crap. All your posts seem to revolve around thoughtless concepts that are completely unsustainable. It's people like you that impede any sort of common-place acceptance of hho.

That's why I'm an A-hole. Learn some science and stop it with the OU crap.

[oicu812]

hey **** for brains.... who said anything about overunity , ****ing retard.

[Philldpapill]

Nice.

You did in previous posts. You spew ignorant crap in nearly all of your posts. In this particular thread, no, you didn't mention OU. Using Aluminum as a reaction base to produce hydrogen is nothing new. In addition to the H2 that's created, you're also creating some rather nasty chemicals that are being fed directly into your engine's intake(assuming you are using NaOH or some other strong base). What, are you now going to replace your gasoline fuel for a storage tank to hold all the alkaline chemicals and your aluminum rods?

[oicu812]

Once again you've shown what an ignorant ******* you are. What nasty chemicals are produced? alumina aka aluminium oxide... its in your toothpaste dumb$hit. not like the hexachromium your making. by the way what have you've ever contributed this board beside your useless dribble. I'm hoping you develope cancer from your waste chemicals.

[Philldpapill]

No, that's not all you get. You have Na+ ions floating around in there, ready to combine with various things in your engine. That isn't good. As far as hexachromium.... care to elaborate WHAT chemical?

You're right, I guess I haven't contributed anything to these forums. I first came here looking for people to help me test out a measurement/control device I have been working on. It was very sophisticated and would allow the user to make "intelligent" experiments in order to REALLY prove how well hho works. I got 2 half warm replies.

I haven't been on this forum for very long(early June), but the majority of people I have seen on this forum are not of a scientific mind. Don't get me wrong, there are a few which I have a lot of respect for and that statement doesn't apply to them at all. However, the ones that it does apply to, including you oicu, don't seem to be interested in really proving anything other than telling your buddies the end result - an increase in mpg, rather than theories of what is going on, or giving any REAL data.

To summerize, I'm not going to be on here anymore. I'm sure you will make some sny remark of "good don't let the door hit you on the way out". I don't care. I was looking for a community that pursued science, rather than disregarded it as if hho is a magic, "laws of physics" breaking substance(e.g. Stan Meyers). This post is a waste of time. In fact, nearly all the posts were a waste of time since they ALL got completely off topic each time.