PWM Power Supply Unit - Features suggestions wanted

[Philldpapill]

Hey, all! I came across this forum via Zero Fossil Fuel's Website. I've been fascinated by electrolysis and producing Hydrogen for years. I'm writing this post to try to get some suggestions for a device I'm making... But first, a little info about me...

I'm in my senior year studying Electrical Engineering at the University of Texas. I love designing electronics. I've been tinkering around with hydrogen production for a few years now, off and on. I've been learning alot, these past 3 years in school, and I hope some of my insight into the electrical aspects of HHO can be an asset to the community. This is my first posting, and I hope only the first of many.

Now, let me get to the meat of this post. I'm currently designing a new PWM unit for HHO Production. I'm designing this because it's a really fun project for me, and also because I hope it can be a VERY valuable tool for everyone here. This little gadget is extremely different from every unit I've seen in use. It is NOT a simple frequency/duty cycle adjuster. It's more like a computer. Well, it IS a computer in a way. It has a sophisticated 8 core multiprocessor inside that allows it to do some really funky things... This gadget has the ability to interface with your computer/laptop, and display all sorts of real-time data. It's main purpose is to be a data collection tool, in addition to the onboard 75A high frequency PWM unit(>500kHz, and under some conditions into the MHz range...). Some of the features include:

1. Real-time data logging of current consumption, voltage, power consumption, HHO cell temperature, among various other things.
2. Real-time graphing of all the items listed above, for visual analysis.
3. Frequency sweeping, and logging information about power consumption vs. frequency. This could be used as a major tool to find any sort of resonant frequency of your cell...
4. Programmable test procedures - e.g. running the PWM for a precise amount of time, then turning off automatically, or when a certain gas pressure is reached(under development), among many more.
5. Ability to interface with your PC, or run standalone as a regular PWM unit with minimal additional features.
6. FULLY UPGRADEABLE SOFTWARE! The best part about this device, is when the community wants a new feature added, I can program this into the device, and mass distribute the update to anyone who has a unit. The update would be on your computer, and would be automatically downloaded to the device upon startup. Just connect a USB cable, and BAM! New features(and hopefully none will ever occur, but bug fixes)!
7. More suggestions needed! I'm still designing this device, and would really like some input from you guys as far as what you would want in a device like this.

I'd like to start building some of these units, and getting some beta testers. If you are interested in the testing phase, let me know. I'm not looking to make a big profit, so I'm going to try and get these to be priced under $100(hopefully). In the mean time, I need TESTERS!

[oicu812]

count me in bro... i'ld love to beta test for you. I was looking for a computer interfaced pwm anyway.

[H2OPWR]

That is what we need. A real computer attached with the ability to program in what we want. My suggestion to make this thing really be very useful would to have the fuel injector pulse width actually control the duty cycle. More fuel would equal more HHO. That is the one issue that I have not been able to beat. When I crank my cell up to produce what my truck really needs my idle goes crazy. My truck becomes almost undrivable because it idles too fast. I then turn the cell down so the truck will idle and I lose gains at normal crusing speeds. I really need the best of both worlds to get what I need.

Larry

[BoyntonStu]

My simple system idea.

Engines can run leaner than 14.7:1 but the ECU forces it to remain 14.7:1.


OTOH Lean mixtures equate to higher CHT and EGT.


I suggest a link between CHT/GGT and the pulse width of the fuel pump.

Think of it as a CHT thermostat.

The circuit would maintain the maximum safe CHT/EGT and then increase the pulse width to reduce the temperature.


This circuit in addition the air restriction, could realize about a 20% increase in MPG without HHO.

(Air restriction fools the ECU into thinking that the car is being fed less dense air at at a mile high altitude as in Denver, CO.

The ECU will reduce the gas to maintain the programmed 14.7:1 NOT LEAN))

However, I would use HHO to reduce the emissions if the above did not yield acceptable emission results.

BoyntonStu

[Philldpapill]

Thos are great ideas! I think adding in support for automatically adjusting output while driving is a awesome! I'll definitely need a tester for that, since I'm not equiped to do that in my car right now... That's going to need alot of work though. I'm taking a control systems class this summer, so I hope it can help with that sort of thing. Afterall, the device would have to be a type of control system for regulating the production - which it totally has the potential to do.

As far as "in the lab" stuff goes, that's the stuff I'm really looking for(for now). I'm trying to get this thing to be a really sophisticated lab instrument/powerful PWM with high current handling(done).

Oh, one feature I thought of last night - Battery Charging/Monitoring! I'm thinking about adding a couple of "jacks" to clip on a battery charger. This way, the gadget can also act as a sophisticated battery charging system. A normal battery charger just tries to cram charge into the battery, even when it's fully charged. My "internal" battery charger would monitor the voltage on the battery, and determine it's state of charge. If it's really low, it could apply certain charging algorithms to increase the life of the battery. Of course, it would also disconnect when the battery is fully charged so you don't have to worry about over charging.

Most of these ideas I have are more "bench top" oriented ideas. I'd love to have this mounted in a car/truck for REAL use one day, but for now I'm trying to use it for testing just the production of HHO.

Thanks guys!

[Bassman]

That is what we need. A real computer attached with the ability to program in what we want. My suggestion to make this thing really be very useful would to have the fuel injector pulse width actually control the duty cycle. More fuel would equal more HHO. That is the one issue that I have not been able to beat. When I crank my cell up to produce what my truck really needs my idle goes crazy. My truck becomes almost undrivable because it idles too fast. I then turn the cell down so the truck will idle and I lose gains at normal crusing speeds. I really need the best of both worlds to get what I need.

Larry
Wouldn't there be a lag in the response time that the HHO was requested and when it was produced and actually got to the intake? It may still be better then what you have now.

[H2OPWR]

Wouldn't there be a lag in the response time that the HHO was requested and when it was produced and actually got to the intake? It may still be better then what you have now.

As long as the supply lines were full of HHO and the cell and bubbler were full of HHO then the supply should be almost immediate with very little lag. If the cell was hooked to vacuum then the responce would lag quite a bit. None the less the end product would be better than anything we have now.

Larry

[Philldpapill]

I think the solution to the problem of "delay", is a little analagous to a capacitor in electronics. If you have a storage tank that stores HHO under a SLIGHT pressure, and a valve on the output to allow the gas to go into the engine and escape the tank, then the problem could be alleviated somewhat. Granted, a storage tank is dangerous, but it would certainly help with the response time.

I'm still looking for ideas and beta testers though...

[kasari]

Count me in...

Working on a Whole Home Heater using HHO. Already have a Energy Management System (EMS) (BAS) in my house. I could incorporate your devide in this system.

Control Freak..:D

[Q-Hack!]

Count me in...

Working on a Whole Home Heater using HHO. Already have a Energy Management System (EMS) (BAS) in my house. I could incorporate your devide in this system.

Control Freak..:D

Not sure I understand what you mean by this... the whole idea here is so that he can control the vehicle's ECU. How do you plan to incorporate this into a home heating unit? All you are worried about is the average temperature of each room. Control tends to be rather binary. On/Off. The EMS does the rest (ie. controls which vents are open/closed) What possible good would it be to add a computer that takes in information like O2 sensor or EGT (neither exist in a home) and puts out a control signal to lean the engine (again useless in the home). Am I just missing something?

Edit: I suppose the logging feature would be handy.

[Philldpapill]

I've got a new feature... Gas production monitoring.

The usual method of measuring how long it takes to fill a 1 liter bottle works great. You just can't see how the gas production is being affected unless you keep doing this test.

The method I've been working on(as of yesterday), is fairly simple... Here's how it works:
I have some very sensitive pressure sensors from FreeScale Semiconductor. These are electronic devices that measure air pressure. A tube can be attached to the sensor to measure the pressure in a tube. If you've ever had a realllllly long water hose, and tried to water your plants with it, you may have noticed that the pressure at the far end of the hose is just a little more than at the faucet. This pressure drop is proportional to how much water is flowing. This is kind of how my meter would work.

If you have a sensor at one end of some tubing, coming from your HHO generator, and then make that hose get crimped off so it's just barely open for gas to still flow through it, you will create some back pressure in the hose line. This pressure is proportional to the amount gas being produced and flowing through the line. If you measure this pressure, you can calculated how much HHO is being produced. This sort of thing would be super easy to implement on my gadget.

This way, you can get a real-time MMW calculation!

I've done some testing today, and I'm getting pretty good results. It's just a matter of caliberation, and finding a few properties of H2 and O2 that determine some stuff in the calculations. Once these values are found, I think the measurement will be more accurate.