no gains

[ser456123]

Hi
Has anyone gotten any positive results on an 05 or later model toyota v6 engine.
I have been trying with my 05 sienna with a maf enhancer but not able to get any gains.

Generator(Plumabob style)
Pulling 12amps @.60lpm
Maf enhancer
Mileage before hho 17mpg after 15mpg.

Any thoughts or ideas appreciated.
Thanks

[hg2]

Hi
Has anyone gotten any positive results on an 05 or later model toyota v6 engine.
I have been trying with my 05 sienna with a maf enhancer but not able to get any gains.

Generator(Plumabob style)
Pulling 12amps @.60lpm
Maf enhancer
Mileage before hho 17mpg after 15mpg.

Any thoughts or ideas appreciated.
Thanks

I would start by raising the hho lpm at least 2.5 - 3.I think .6 is not near enough for a V6

[Scooterdog]

Hi
Has anyone gotten any positive results on an 05 or later model toyota v6 engine.
I have been trying with my 05 sienna with a maf enhancer but not able to get any gains.

Generator(Plumabob style)
Pulling 12amps @.60lpm
Maf enhancer
Mileage before hho 17mpg after 15mpg.

Any thoughts or ideas appreciated.
Thanks

Those are the results you can expect using this gobbly gook technology. Popular Mechanics test showed the same results. Less power, and less mpg. I can show you why, not sure if anyone here could understand it, but I can copy the GOOD SCIENCE from one of my other post's on another scam forum. Let me know if you want it. (It really does explain why this is such a joke)

[VanHalen]

You pretty quick to put it down, but while using even the little W4G generator, I measured my MPG just from taking the same pump fill and the odometer readings. Mostly city, I get 16 MPG from HHO, and lately I haven't had one in because of work on my next one. I get about 12 w no driving changes...

W HHO-16MPG
W/O HHO- 12MPG

Call me wrong, as I'm sure you will. All I know is has helped me, I don't think its a random thing that I gained 4 MPG with a generator in, and with it out lost those 4. I did have the water4gas pullin a good amount of amps though.

But honestly if your just going to browse around this forum downplaying all of the work being put fourth here, why don't you just go do something else?

[VanHalen]

Hi
Has anyone gotten any positive results on an 05 or later model toyota v6 engine.
I have been trying with my 05 sienna with a maf enhancer but not able to get any gains.

Generator(Plumabob style)
Pulling 12amps @.60lpm
Maf enhancer
Mileage before hho 17mpg after 15mpg.

Any thoughts or ideas appreciated.
Thanks

I think that you need more LPM. I believe you will lose MPG until you balance out amps/LPM.

[Scooterdog]

You pretty quick to put it down, but while using even the little W4G generator, I measured my MPG just from taking the same pump fill and the odometer readings. Mostly city, I get 16 MPG from HHO, and lately I haven't had one in because of work on my next one. I get about 12 w no driving changes...

W HHO-16MPG
W/O HHO- 12MPG

Call me wrong, as I'm sure you will. All I know is has helped me, I don't think its a random thing that I gained 4 MPG with a generator in, and with it out lost those 4. I did have the water4gas pullin a good amount of amps though.

But honestly if your just going to browse around this forum downplaying all of the work being put fourth here, why don't you just go do something else?


Impossible!!!! You are dead wrong. There is no way, NO WAY ON GOD'S GREEN EARTH that you have obtained those results from an "hho" system. It cannot be done!

[sumdude]

have you tried one of these hho units in your vehicle personally? As for me, my first attempt did not increase MPG but acceleration from a dead stop, passing on the highway, increased DRASTICALLY. It was noticeable to the point where my friend that is usually in the car with me asked if i did a tune-up.


After messing around with 02 voltage and MAP i went from 19-24 in the city. Still haven't done highway as yet as im not on there too often


Impossible!!!! You are dead wrong. There is no way, NO WAY ON GOD'S GREEN EARTH that you have obtained those results from an "hho" system. It cannot be done!

[Scooterdog]

have you tried one of these hho units in your vehicle personally? As for me, my first attempt did not increase MPG but acceleration from a dead stop, passing on the highway, increased DRASTICALLY. It was noticeable to the point where my friend that is usually in the car with me asked if i did a tune-up.


After messing around with 02 voltage and MAP i went from 19-24 in the city. Still haven't done highway as yet as im not on there too often

You are leaning out the engine, and it won't last long. No, I wouldn't never attach that crap to my expensive auto, just so I could replace the engine in a short time.

Look, I went to school for this, I know what I'm talking about. I don't care what backyard "mechanic" or some scammer claims. It can't be proven because it is smoke and mirrors. I've provided that math, that cannot be over ridden on a whim. It is fact.

you cannot gain more power from hho by tying into your vehicles electricle system, it's simple math.

[scrode]

You are leaning out the engine, and it won't last long. No, I wouldn't never attach that crap to my expensive auto, just so I could replace the engine in a short time.

Look, I went to school for this, I know what I'm talking about. I don't care what backyard "mechanic" or some scammer claims. It can't be proven because it is smoke and mirrors. I've provided that math, that cannot be over ridden on a whim. It is fact.

you cannot gain more power from hho by tying into your vehicles electricle system, it's simple math.

What a dope!! yeah its simple math, you need to go back to first grade, dumbass. What school did you go to? the pre school next door to your mom"s?

So its my imagination that my mpgs increased? what a ****in idiot

[Scooterdog]

What a dope!! yeah its simple math, you need to go back to first grade, dumbass. What school did you go to? the pre school next door to your mom"s?

So its my imagination that my mpgs increased? what a ****in idiot

maybe you need to grow up, and watch your mouth. Perhaps a little education wouldn't hurt either. Punch holes in the math if you can, or shut your potty mouth.

[sumdude]

You took the words right out of my mouth. Im not even going to respond to him again as he first come one this forum talking all this ish about his infinite degree in XX and blah blah. I guess all this hho hype being on the news to the point where police agencies has experimented on some of their vehicles and has seen increase in both POWER and mpg.

I would never come out bashing people and the entire experiment like this ignorant idiot is doing. I'm a computer engineer and if someone came to me one day and said that there was a way to compute infinity in a second on a virtual platform I would not tell the person to stfu because I have had years of schooling and its not possible.

Let me end this with, BMW must be a ****ing dumbass then to even think of implementing the hydrogen 7 onto the market. I guess that german engineering "scam" is bull***t then.


What a dope!! yeah its simple math, you need to go back to first grade, dumbass. What school did you go to? the pre school next door to your mom"s?

So its my imagination that my mpgs increased? what a ****in idiot

[richardb200373]

Scooter, if you don't have anything positive to say, which you don't , and if you are'nt here to help or get help on a build, why don't you just scoot on to another site! This site is a forum to help people out. While you may think you know everything, there are other people here that do have gains in MPG.

[Scooterdog]

Scooter, if you don't have anything positive to say, which you don't , and if you are'nt here to help or get help on a build, why don't you just scoot on to another site! This site is a forum to help people out. While you may think you know everything, there are other people here that do have gains in MPG.

PROVE they have made these gains. Put up or shut up. When people make false claims like that, its just sickning. The math and science proves it cannot, will not work as you people are claiming.

The only mpg gains are comming from 1-leaning out the engine thereby destroying it over time, 2-tunning up the vehicle, then making a false claim that "hho" worked, 3-driving differently after adding this crap to the engine, and not admitting to it.

HHO will not, it CAN NOT, not matter how bad you want it to work like people claim, work. This has been tested for years, by people with more money than you will ever see, with technology none of you can understand, it it didn't hold up.

[scrode]

Its true most of the gains are from leaning the fuel, BUT you are compensating the lean with hho and its properties when combined with fuel.

[Scooterdog]

You took the words right out of my mouth. Im not even going to respond to him again as he first come one this forum talking all this ish about his infinite degree in XX and blah blah. I guess all this hho hype being on the news to the point where police agencies has experimented on some of their vehicles and has seen increase in both POWER and mpg.

I would never come out bashing people and the entire experiment like this ignorant idiot is doing. I'm a computer engineer and if someone came to me one day and said that there was a way to compute infinity in a second on a virtual platform I would not tell the person to stfu because I have had years of schooling and its not possible.

Let me end this with, BMW must be a ****ing dumbass then to even think of implementing the hydrogen 7 onto the market. I guess that german engineering "scam" is bull***t then.


Hydrogen and hho are not the same damn thing. HHO is a joke, and people claiming it works are either to stupid to realize who stupid they sound, or are part of the scam.

Plain and simple, you can't just add whatever to your engine, it isn't designed for it. But some well educated person such as yourself probably already knew this, so that would make you---Part of the scam??/

[scrode]

Hydrogen and hho are not the same damn thing. HHO is a joke, and people claiming it works are either to stupid to realize who stupid they sound, or are part of the scam.

Plain and simple, you can't just add whatever to your engine, it isn't designed for it. But some well educated person such as yourself probably already knew this, so that would make you---Part of the scam??/

Your the joke there pooterdick. I bet you voted for Bush and are going to vote for Mc numbnuts.
You need to pull your head out of your arse and see the real world.

[Scooterdog]

Its true most of the gains are from leaning the fuel, BUT you are compensating the lean with hho and its properties when combined with fuel.

Don't be stupid! Or, if you are going to be stupid, go get stupid on someone elses time.

you let the cat out of the bag! you are clueless to how an engine works. Gas, from the pump, actually plays a role in lubrication. So, by leaning it, you are tearing the engine up. No amount of "gas" like hydrogen or this fake hho is going to take the place of gas from the pump. You would need to completely redesign the parts for the engine.

It would be like someone saying "ya, I added propane with no mods, like valve seats, valves, pistons, piston rings, valve guides, and it works". Yep, for about 2000 miles, then you've burnt that engine up. Go buy another one.

You people are so clueless about automotive technology, with some wacked out theories that are about as helpfull cancer.

[scrode]

PROVE they have made these gains. Put up or shut up. When people make false claims like that, its just sickning. The math and science proves it cannot, will not work as you people are claiming.

The only mpg gains are comming from 1-leaning out the engine thereby destroying it over time, 2-tunning up the vehicle, then making a false claim that "hho" worked, 3-driving differently after adding this crap to the engine, and not admitting to it.

HHO will not, it CAN NOT, not matter how bad you want it to work like people claim, work. This has been tested for years, by people with more money than you will ever see, with technology none of you can understand, it it didn't hold up.
Tell that to NASA, the Military. Until YOU have tested and proven it wrong stfu. just because you've been to school (preschool) doesn't make you right(far from it) I proved it myself that it works. I've gone close to 8000 on my car and it is in better condition than when I bought it. your just a frickin dumbass go somewhere you are appreciated (disney.com) the mousekateers need a leader.

[Scooterdog]

Tell that to NASA, the Military. Until YOU have tested and proven it wrong stfu. just because you've been to school (preschool) doesn't make you right(far from it) I proved it myself that it works.

Sure ya do. Take the million dollar challange kid, see where you get? What's that? Can't afford it? Don't want to look like the fool that you are when it all goes south.

Show me the math and science that these vehicle are getting these results. I've already given the formula that proves this is nothing but bunk being pushed by people who are scammers.

By the way, I don't think Wyoming Tech, one of the leading schools in Automotive Technology in the world, is a "pre-school". Is'nt it past your (or is it you're) bedtime?

[sumdude]

Ok lets see. thread started from someone asking about their toyota. got hijacked by "know it all" now argument again about if hho works or not.

Honestly this guy must really not have a life. If im in the situation where no one is listening to me i honestly would pack my ish and leave. Its obvious your not convincing anyone around here with all your knowledge and is just wasting this sites bandwidth. Go join a automotive forum with all the other skeptics out there and talk about your crap.

We are here to exchange our ideas on our cell designs and whatnot. I'm not speaking for anyone else in this forum but you are getting really annoying now with this crap. Your like the virus on this site. Always has something negative to say.

Your here pleading to these people, im going to use your word 'scammers', that its not going to work. Ok you did your part let them learn from their mistakes if there are none. Just chill with all this please.

[Scooterdog]

Ok lets see. thread started from someone asking about their toyota. got hijacked by "know it all" now argument again about if hho works or not.

Honestly this guy must really not have a life. If im in the situation where no one is listening to me i honestly would pack my ish and leave. Its obvious your not convincing anyone around here with all your knowledge and is just wasting this sites bandwidth. Go join a automotive forum with all the other skeptics out there and talk about your crap.

We are here to exchange our ideas on our cell designs and whatnot. I'm not speaking for anyone else in this forum but you are getting really annoying now with this crap. Your like the virus on this site. Always has something negative to say.

Your here pleading to these people, im going to use your word 'scammers', that its not going to work. Ok you did your part let them learn from their mistakes if there are none. Just chill with all this please.


Heres the proof, either you prove me wrong, or shut your mouth: (I posted this earlier)

By passing an electrical current through water, you can break the bonds that hold the atoms of hydrogen and oxygen together in the form of a water molecule.

This is good science and is a process that has been known since the 1800s.

To break these bonds however, requires a significant amount of electrical energy that must come from somewhere. In the case of the RYCOW systems, this energy has to come from the vehicle's alternator and in most cases, that limits the amount of available power to around 0.75-1.0KW.

Of course that 1KW or so also has to recharge the vehicle's battery, power the ignition, headlights etc, and run the various other accessories that abound in a modern car or truck.

So it's safer to assume that only around 600W is always available for the electrolysis cell, which is a maximum of around 50 amps.

Now if we delve into some more good science we find this formula for Faraday's First Law:

Vtheoretical (in m3) = (R I T t) / (F p z)

Where R=8.3414 Joule/(mol Kelvin), I=current(in amps), T=temp in Kelvin, t=time (in seconds) F=Faraday's constant = 96485 Coulombs per mol, p=ambient pressure (pascals), z=num of excess electrons.

If we plug some numbers into this formula and do some simple conversions then the following results appear:

237.1KJ is required to convert 1 Mole of water (18g) to H2/O2

To convert 1 Mole of water to gas via electrolysis will reuire 237.1KJ of energy

1 litre of H2O produces 55.55 Moles of H2 (1,358.3l) and 27.775 Moles (679.15l) of O2 (for a total volume of 2037.45l of H2/O2)

To convert 1 litre of H2O to H2 and O2 by electrolysis will require 3.658KWH
Of course all the above assumes a 100% efficiency and as we know this is simply not attainable with current materials and technology.

To get an idea as to how efficient the electrolysis process is when performed in a home-made electrolyser I found plenty of videos on YouTube where people proudly share their results.

This example is pretty typical so let's do the math:

12V x 40A ==> 480W

If we plug Faraday's First law into this figure, it suggest that in a 100% efficient cell we should be generating around 4.5 liters per minute of H2/O2 from 480W of electrical energy.

The cell in the YouTube video produces just 2.0 liters per minute, indicating an actual efficiency of around 44% - so we'll assume 50% efficiency for the rest of our calculations.

Now we need to take a look at some of the scientific research that demonstrates how hydrogen/oxygen enrichment can improve engine efficiency.

Now let's plug in some other figures and see if we can get a net-gain.

The engine in that paper was producing around 6.5HP at 1,500RPMs and needed 240 liters per hour (4 liters per minute) of H2/O2 gas.

An average auto engine will be capable of around 200HP and so a simple scaling would indicate that 30 times the 4lpm figure (or 120lpm) would be required to see the same 15% increase at full throttle. Of course we don't drive around at full throttle all the time so a safer figure to use would be the 20HP or so that an average-sized car requires to cruise at highway speeds.

20HP / 6.5HP = 3 times the horsepower so we'll need 3 times the fuel and three times the H2/O2 gas to see the same effect. That brings our H2/O2 requirement to 12.0 lpm.

Actually, at this stage we must also take into consideration that the engine in the paper was as diesel which uses significantly less fuel to create the same HP (due to the higher compression ratios and naturally more efficient cycle) -- that's why diesel vehicles get better MPGs than gasoline-powered ones. So we'll allow a very conservative additional 20% to account for the greater mass of gasoline required to produce the same power.

That lifts the H2/O2 gas requirement to 14.4 lpm.

Now we see that the addition of 14.4 lpm of H2/O2 should (according to the scientific reports) increase our engine's horsepower by 14.8%-15% (we already decided to use the latter figure).

We're assuming a 20HP requirement for cruise speed so once we add the 14.4 lpm of H2/O2 the engine will output an additional 20 x 0.15 = three horsepower.

So far so good.

Next we have to work out how much energy we'll be taking back in order to create those 14.4lpm of H2/O2.

If we use Faraday's First Law again to calculate that figure we discover that we need around 1,536 watts - but that's only if our electrolysis cell was 100% efficient, which it's not.

We've assumed an efficiency (based on real-world figures) of just 50% for the electrolysis process so we need to double that figure -- which gives us 3,072W of electrical energy required to generate sufficient H2/O2 to give us the maximum fuel-efficiency improvement at cruise speeds.

That 3,072W is 4.1 horsepower.

Uh-oh, it looks like we're spending 4.1 horsepower creating H2/O2 gas but only getting 3 horsepower back. That's a net *loss* of 1.1hp which mean's we'll actually burn *more* fuel than if we hadn't gone to all this trouble.

But wait... it gets worse...

That 4.1hp assumes that our alternator is 100% efficient in turning mechanical energy into electrical energy -- which it certainly is not.

An auto-style alternator is actually only around 60% efficient so the actual amount of horsepower we'll be sucking from the engine to power our cell is going to be around 6.8hp.

Now we find that the net energy return from these "H.H.O." systems is an even bigger. We're spending 6.8 horsepower to boost the engine's output by just 3 horsepower.

That missing 3.8 horsepower will have to come from burning *MORE* not less gasoline.

I'm sorry -- but those are the facts, there is the science.

I invite anyone to pick holes in my science or my math.

[sumdude]

AS i said before im not going to get into this crap again. Have fun arguing with yourself. Good night. Going to the rest of my life, my gf :confused:.

[FuzzyTomCat]

Hi All,

Here is a post that I did on another forum, you all may find helpful in some little way.

The "requirement" to be polite goes back to the very best tradition in science, where it used to be assumed that honest, intelligent, well-meaning experimenters could hold unique, and divergent opinions and interpretations regarding the same, observed phenomena. No one was assumed to be "wrong" or "bad" because they held a differing opinion. It created an environment for lively debate and in-depth investigation. The only requirements for this environment to flourish were intelligence and civility.

This is a PUBLIC FORUM. Anyone in the world can view it. It would be SOCIALLY IRRESPONSIBLE to leave posts that disparage a person's character in such a forum. NO ONE has the right to turn this forum into a billboard for their rude and uncivil behavior.

Thank you all for your participation at this Forum and in this effort !

Regards,
Fuzzy

[Scooterdog]

AS i said before im not going to get into this crap again. Have fun arguing with yourself. Good night. Going to the rest of my life, my gf :confused:.

There you have it! Just walk away when someone proves you wrong. By God, never admit to the lie hu?

If you're so damn smart, PROVE ME WRONG! :mad:

I'm getting sick and tired of you people calling me names, cursing, when I got banned for it. I have provided FACTS, and you just keep it up. If you can prove me wrong, do it! But enough of this scam is enough!

I have a degree in Automotive Technology from one of the most respected schools in the world. I've never said that makes me a better person than anyone else, but, it does prove I have more knowledge than ANYONE else on this site. If you can't take the heat, stay out of the kitchen.

[scrode]

so it comes down to what you use from the alternator? hahah i just use the UNUSED amps, not making more amps that my alternator puts out, your computations are ASSumining that you are just running the alternator to create hho. what a ---. In the real world the alternator puts out more amps than are used. so my 15 amps are really sucking the horsepower. what a ----. You need to quit drinking the koolaid. your math is cool but it doesn't apply to the real aspects of the technology being used

[Scooterdog]

Hi All,

Here is a post that I did on another forum, you all may find helpful in some little way.

The "requirement" to be polite goes back to the very best tradition in science, where it used to be assumed that honest, intelligent, well-meaning experimenters could hold unique, and divergent opinions and interpretations regarding the same, observed phenomena. No one was assumed to be "wrong" or "bad" because they held a differing opinion. It created an environment for lively debate and in-depth investigation. The only requirements for this environment to flourish were intelligence and civility.

This is a PUBLIC FORUM. Anyone in the world can view it. It would be SOCIALLY IRRESPONSIBLE to leave posts that disparage a person's character in such a forum. NO ONE has the right to turn this forum into a billboard for their rude and uncivil behavior.

Thank you all for your participation at this Forum and in this effort !

Regards,
Fuzzy


Well, then, why don't we take a look into some of the pms I've gotten, as well as post's. I've been called everything from a ********* to a homosexual. Yet, NOT ONE OF THESE MEMBERS DOING THIS ARE BANNED! Yet you banned me for a few swear words trying to make a point not directed at anyone?

Free Speech, it's not something a moderator can simply over-ride. If you are banning certain people for certain things, it must apply equally, not what ever makes the "group" happy.

[Scooterdog]

so it comes down to what you use from the alternator? hahah i just use the UNUSED amps, not making more amps that my alternator puts out, your computations are ASSumining that you are just running the alternator to create hho. what a ---. In the real world the alternator puts out more amps than are used. so my 15 amps are really sucking the horsepower. what a ----. You need to quit drinking the koolaid. your math is cool but it doesn't apply to the real aspects of the technology being used

No proof hu? Just as I suspected. More opinion from someone with a complete lack of knowledge in automotive technology.

Where are these "extra" amps going? Into thin air? Explain this one to us, I'd love to hear it, as would a few others.

[scrode]

Well, then, why don't we take a look into some of the pms I've gotten, as well as post's. I've been called everything from a ********* to a homosexual. Yet, NOT ONE OF THESE MEMBERS DOING THIS ARE BANNED! Yet you banned me for a few swear words trying to make a point not directed at anyone?

Free Speech, it's not something a moderator can simply over-ride. If you are banning certain people for certain things, it must apply equally, not what ever makes the "group" happy.

a moderator can do whatever he likes its not a democracy its a forum and he who owns forum rules.
If you don't like well get the fu-k on
peace

[Scooterdog]

a moderator can do whatever he likes its not a democracy its a forum and he who owns forum rules.
If you don't like well get the fu-k on
peace

Oh really? The Federal Courts say differently. Wanna try to argue law with me too? I'll walk all over you kid.

[scrode]

No proof hu? Just as I suspected. More opinion from someone with a complete lack of knowledge in automotive technology.

Where are these "extra" amps going? Into thin air? Explain this one to us, I'd love to hear it, as would a few others.

I use them to run my gen. hahahahahahahaha
your a fool to try and argue with someone you can't and never will change.
you see, some of us here have been using this technology and will be using this technology for some time having seen and proved that it works. so go to disney.com and maybe they will listen to you, GOOFY.:D

BTW. who is this us? you got a turd in your pocket?

[scrode]

Oh really? The Federal Courts say differently. Wanna try to argue law with me too? I'll walk all over you kid.

Federal courts have no jurisdiction on any forum. it is governed by the owner and HIS/HER moderators. The internet isn't ruled by american courts especially private forums. what a newb.
Kid? I'm probably your daddy btw what was your mommas name maybe ill remember her, SON

[Scooterdog]

I use them to run my gen. hahahahahahahaha
your a fool to try and argue with someone you can't and never will change.
you see, some of us here have been using this technology and will be using this technology for some time having seen and proved that it works. so go to disney.com and maybe they will listen to you, GOOFY.:D

BTW. who is this us? you got a turd in your pocket?

You really are a peace of work, wow. You claimed there were "extra" amps. Where did they go before you put on ths crap product that won't do anything but cause less hp and mpg? Where did they go before???

If you are running hho, it's costing you more in gas. clearly you can't understand the math and science.

"Technology". LOL, if that's what you call it. Smoke and Mirrors is more like it.

[Scooterdog]

Federal courts have no jurisdiction on any forum. it is governed by the owner and HIS/HER moderators. The internet isn't ruled by american courts especially private forums. what a newb.
Kid? I'm probably your daddy btw what was your mommas name maybe ill remember her, SON

Wow! Guess you never heard of the FCC, or Federal Jurisdiction. How old are you? Ten? Never heard of Federal Internet Laws either I assume.

[scrode]

costing more, what an idiot, my wife drives 100 miles a day and has saved hundreds since using the hho smoke and mirrors, SON. and thanks for the compliment. it seems you cant understand the math and the science. math is =I get 40mpg instead of 28. science is= it works. no matter what you say or write can't change the fact that I'm getting great gains with hho. so stfu, SON

[Scooterdog]

costing more, what an idiot, my wife drives 100 miles a day and has saved hundreds since using the hho smoke and mirrors, SON. and thanks for the compliment. it seems you cant understand the math and the science. math is =I get 40mpg instead of 28. science is= it works. no matter what you say or write can't change the fact that I'm getting great gains with hho. so stfu, SON

If it worked, you'd be selling this crap and retire in a month! GM, FORD, ETC.. would be there offering you a fortune. But that just aint happening is it?

Take the million dollar challange. Surely, with the "big savings" you CLAIM you are getting(which you are not getting) you can get involved in a REAL WORLD test, and come out rich in the end.

I know, you can't afford it, heard it before. Your hero ozzy the scam artist is in hidding right now. Wonder why?

[scrode]

Wow! Guess you never heard of the FCC, or Federal Jurisdiction. How old are you? Ten? Never heard of Federal Internet Laws either I assume.

It only applies in commerce and if I use the internet to defraud or use it to cause someone harm. seems you haven't read them either I'm done with your dumbass. I have more important things to do ( like bang your mom) Son. hhahahahahahaha laters BIATCH. ewwww call the feds I swore.

[FuzzyTomCat]

Hi all,

The second time for me to post this on the forum now on a different thread, may you find it helpful.

The "requirement" to be polite goes back to the very best tradition in science, where it used to be assumed that honest, intelligent, well-meaning experimenters could hold unique, and divergent opinions and interpretations regarding the same, observed phenomena. No one was assumed to be "wrong" or "bad" because they held a differing opinion. It created an environment for lively debate and in-depth investigation. The only requirements for this environment to flourish were intelligence and civility.

This is a PUBLIC FORUM. Anyone in the world can view it. It would be SOCIALLY IRRESPONSIBLE to leave posts that disparage a person's character in such a forum. NO ONE has the right to turn this forum into a billboard for their rude and uncivil behavior.

Thank you for your precipitation at this Forum and on this matter.

Regards,
Fuzzy

[Scooterdog]

It only applies in commerce and if I use the internet to defraud or use it to cause someone harm. seems you haven't read them either I'm done with your dumbass. I have more important things to do ( like bang your mom) Son. hhahahahahahaha laters BIATCH. ewwww call the feds I swore.

You certainly are ignorant. Wonder why these cases of people getting banned by websites are making it to Federal Court, and the complainant is winning everytime? Hummmmm.

Aint' working out to well for good ol Ozzy Freedom, well known scam artist.

[H2OPWR]

No proof hu? Just as I suspected. More opinion from someone with a complete lack of knowledge in automotive technology.

Where are these "extra" amps going? Into thin air? Explain this one to us, I'd love to hear it, as would a few others.

I have only a couple questions I would like you to answer honestly if you can answer honestly. If you really beleive everything you are posting and really have a degree in Automotive engineering, Two law degrees and run a multimillion dollar drilling operation.

1) Why are you wasting your time here.
2) How do you have enough time to post enough to become a mentor in such a short time.
3) Why do you care how we spend our time and money.


Remember answer honestly. I do not think you understand honesty or even have the concept of helping anyone. I think you have no degrees and spend all your time just F*****ing with people for your own perverted pleasure. Don't worry some day you will grow up and spend your time working for causes you beleive in (right or wrong) and ignoring the causes you feel are not important.

[bigapple]

I have only a couple questions I would like you to answer honestly if you can answer honestly. If you really beleive everything you are posting and really have a degree in Automotive engineering, Two law degrees and run a multimillion dollar drilling operation.

1) Why are you wasting your time here.
2) How do you have enough time to post enough to become a mentor in such a short time.
3) Why do you care how we spend our time and money.


Remember answer honestly. I do not think you understand honesty or even have the concept of helping anyone. I think you have no degrees and spend all your time just F*****ing with people for your own perverted pleasure. Don't worry some day you will grow up and spend your time working for causes you beleive in (right or wrong) and ignoring the causes you feel are not important.

This dude nailed exactly what I was thinking. Scooter, if you're trying to do us this HUGE favor to save our lives and we don't listen, WHY ARE YOU STILL HERE?

Do the mature thing and leave everyone here in peace and let them do what they want. It proves your immaturity when you throw around words like "son" when you also say you're not trying to prove you're better than anyone. It's just a huge contradiction.

[Scooterdog]

I have only a couple questions I would like you to answer honestly if you can answer honestly. If you really beleive everything you are posting and really have a degree in Automotive engineering, Two law degrees and run a multimillion dollar drilling operation.

1) Why are you wasting your time here.
2) How do you have enough time to post enough to become a mentor in such a short time.
3) Why do you care how we spend our time and money.


Remember answer honestly. I do not think you understand honesty or even have the concept of helping anyone. I think you have no degrees and spend all your time just F*****ing with people for your own perverted pleasure. Don't worry some day you will grow up and spend your time working for causes you beleive in (right or wrong) and ignoring the causes you feel are not important.

Like most people, your reading and comprehension skills suck. I never said anything about an engineering degree.

Why do I post? Because it's a scam, people living like parasites feeding off of people who are ignorant of what is really happening. (Ignorance, and stupidity are two different things).

I am all grown up, have a fantastic job, and probably pay more in Federal Income Tax alone, than most Gross per year on these websites. But, that's neither here nor there.

The fact remains, this hho is a scam, and people promoting it, or products for it are part of the scam.

Why some people get so upset is obviouse, they are part of the scam. The pms I get, most from mentally challanged persons, but I do get a few that thank me for debunking the junk.

I have posted the science and math, but the SCAMMERS "claim" it isn't FACT. Well, prove me wrong.

Canada tested Hydrogen boosters, and found they were worthless.
A radio show host recently put the crap on his producers car, proved it was bunk and announced it to the world.

Ozzy Freedom is no longer able to run his water4cash comercials as it is a fraud.

Ozzy by the way is in hidding, trying to figure out his next scam. I see him getting free room and board this time.

Popular Mechanics dyno tested a vehicle, showed it was bunk.

The million dollar challange has not had one taker (and never will)

Persons on Ozzy's site have challanged ALL scammers with these great gains to come forward, and do a track test. I believe the man even offers to pay for the track time. not one taker.

Why is it if you people making these rediculous claims can't seem to reproduce them on every other gas engine? (It only works for me lol)

If one of you made this work, and you won't, GM, FORD, DODGE, SAAB, ETC.. would be knocking on your door, handing you boat loads of money for the information.

Scammers claim this is suppressed technology. suppressed by whom?? The "Big Oil", what a joke! This "technology" has been known since the 1800's. How did these sellers get this "hidden technology"?? It's always been there, and nobody is suppressing anything.

Why is it that most of the information about how sensors and engines work on these sites is completely made up?

Why is it that some backyard "mechanic" can produce rediculous results with no money, but yet people, including our own government, with nearly unlimited funds, can't get it to work? I guess all the engineers, scientist, automotive experts are just too stupid to make it work, but people like on these scam sites can? Is this what you are telling me?

Not one person on this site, or anyother, knows how to correctly get a correct mpg reading. You need a dyno to do it. Each tank of gas will very as much as 20% per tank. Also, puttiing one gallon of gas in your car, and coasting down hill is just rediculous.

The only gains people are getting are from 1-tune ups, 2-tire pressure and the like, 3-driving differently and refusing to admit to it, 4-20% variation in each tank, and 5-by leaning the engine out so as to destroy it.


You wanna prove something? Take your wonder vehicle into a school with a dyno, have it tested with/without the hho scam jars, and then have one of the professors there sign a SWORN AFFIDAVIT to the facts! Until something like that comes along, it's all a pack of lies.

[H2OPWR]

Like most people, your reading and comprehension skills suck. I never said anything about an engineering degree.

Why do I post? Because it's a scam, people living like parasites feeding off of people who are ignorant of what is really happening. (Ignorance, and stupidity are two different things).

I am all grown up, have a fantastic job, and probably pay more in Federal Income Tax alone, than most Gross per year on these websites. But, that's neither here nor there.

The fact remains, this hho is a scam, and people promoting it, or products for it are part of the scam.

Why some people get so upset is obviouse, they are part of the scam. The pms I get, most from mentally challanged persons, but I do get a few that thank me for debunking the junk.

I have posted the science and math, but the SCAMMERS "claim" it isn't FACT. Well, prove me wrong.

Canada tested Hydrogen boosters, and found they were worthless.
A radio show host recently put the crap on his producers car, proved it was bunk and announced it to the world.

Ozzy Freedom is no longer able to run his water4cash comercials as it is a fraud.

Ozzy by the way is in hidding, trying to figure out his next scam. I see him getting free room and board this time.

Popular Mechanics dyno tested a vehicle, showed it was bunk.

The million dollar challange has not had one taker (and never will)

Persons on Ozzy's site have challanged ALL scammers with these great gains to come forward, and do a track test. I believe the man even offers to pay for the track time. not one taker.

Why is it if you people making these rediculous claims can't seem to reproduce them on every other gas engine? (It only works for me lol)

If one of you made this work, and you won't, GM, FORD, DODGE, SAAB, ETC.. would be knocking on your door, handing you boat loads of money for the information.

Scammers claim this is suppressed technology. suppressed by whom?? The "Big Oil", what a joke! This "technology" has been known since the 1800's. How did these sellers get this "hidden technology"?? It's always been there, and nobody is suppressing anything.

Why is it that most of the information about how sensors and engines work on these sites is completely made up?

Why is it that some backyard "mechanic" can produce rediculous results with no money, but yet people, including our own government, with nearly unlimited funds, can't get it to work? I guess all the engineers, scientist, automotive experts are just too stupid to make it work, but people like on these scam sites can? Is this what you are telling me?

Not one person on this site, or anyother, knows how to correctly get a correct mpg reading. You need a dyno to do it. Each tank of gas will very as much as 20% per tank. Also, puttiing one gallon of gas in your car, and coasting down hill is just rediculous.

The only gains people are getting are from 1-tune ups, 2-tire pressure and the like, 3-driving differently and refusing to admit to it, 4-20% variation in each tank, and 5-by leaning the engine out so as to destroy it.


You wanna prove something? Take your wonder vehicle into a school with a dyno, have it tested with/without the hho scam jars, and then have one of the professors there sign a SWORN AFFIDAVIT to the facts! Until something like that comes along, it's all a pack of lies.

You still did not answer even one of the questions I asked. WHY? As far as the degrees please go re-read your own posts. The problem with most liar's is that can not remember what they lied about. Tell the truth and you do not have to have a memory. Lets get together and compare tax returns and we will see who pays the most taxes you Retar***.

[H2OPWR]

Like most people, your reading and comprehension skills suck. I never said anything about an engineering degree.

Why do I post? Because it's a scam, people living like parasites feeding off of people who are ignorant of what is really happening. (Ignorance, and stupidity are two different things).

I am all grown up, have a fantastic job, and probably pay more in Federal Income Tax alone, than most Gross per year on these websites. But, that's neither here nor there.

The fact remains, this hho is a scam, and people promoting it, or products for it are part of the scam.

Why some people get so upset is obviouse, they are part of the scam. The pms I get, most from mentally challanged persons, but I do get a few that thank me for debunking the junk.

I have posted the science and math, but the SCAMMERS "claim" it isn't FACT. Well, prove me wrong.

Canada tested Hydrogen boosters, and found they were worthless.
A radio show host recently put the crap on his producers car, proved it was bunk and announced it to the world.

Ozzy Freedom is no longer able to run his water4cash comercials as it is a fraud.

Ozzy by the way is in hidding, trying to figure out his next scam. I see him getting free room and board this time.

Popular Mechanics dyno tested a vehicle, showed it was bunk.

The million dollar challange has not had one taker (and never will)

Persons on Ozzy's site have challanged ALL scammers with these great gains to come forward, and do a track test. I believe the man even offers to pay for the track time. not one taker.

Why is it if you people making these rediculous claims can't seem to reproduce them on every other gas engine? (It only works for me lol)

If one of you made this work, and you won't, GM, FORD, DODGE, SAAB, ETC.. would be knocking on your door, handing you boat loads of money for the information.

Scammers claim this is suppressed technology. suppressed by whom?? The "Big Oil", what a joke! This "technology" has been known since the 1800's. How did these sellers get this "hidden technology"?? It's always been there, and nobody is suppressing anything.

Why is it that most of the information about how sensors and engines work on these sites is completely made up?

Why is it that some backyard "mechanic" can produce rediculous results with no money, but yet people, including our own government, with nearly unlimited funds, can't get it to work? I guess all the engineers, scientist, automotive experts are just too stupid to make it work, but people like on these scam sites can? Is this what you are telling me?

Not one person on this site, or anyother, knows how to correctly get a correct mpg reading. You need a dyno to do it. Each tank of gas will very as much as 20% per tank. Also, puttiing one gallon of gas in your car, and coasting down hill is just rediculous.

The only gains people are getting are from 1-tune ups, 2-tire pressure and the like, 3-driving differently and refusing to admit to it, 4-20% variation in each tank, and 5-by leaning the engine out so as to destroy it.


You wanna prove something? Take your wonder vehicle into a school with a dyno, have it tested with/without the hho scam jars, and then have one of the professors there sign a SWORN AFFIDAVIT to the facts! Until something like that comes along, it's all a pack of lies.

Answer the questions or shut up.

[Scooterdog]

You still did not answer even one of the questions I asked. WHY? As far as the degrees please go re-read your own posts. The problem with most liar's is that can not remember what they lied about. Tell the truth and you do not have to have a memory. Lets get together and compare tax returns and we will see who pays the most taxes you Retar***.

Your questions, are as follows:


1) Why are you wasting your time here.
2) How do you have enough time to post enough to become a mentor in such a short time.
3) Why do you care how we spend our time and money.

My response was simple:


Why do I post? Because it's a scam, people living like parasites feeding off of people who are ignorant of what is really happening. (Ignorance, and stupidity are two different things).

There's your answer. so who's the lier?


Lets get together and compare tax returns and we will see who pays the most taxes you Retar***.

Okay, I'm a consultant in the oil field, I would love to see your "returns" lol. We drill the Bakken formation in North Dakota. What is it you do? Oh ya, tinker in a "shop". I'm more than happy to put my tax returns against ANYONES on these sites.

[Scooterdog]

Answer the questions or shut up.

Kinda bossy ain't ya? I did answer the questions, although I don't know why.

Got that Affidavit yet? :p

[H2OPWR]

Kinda bossy ain't ya? I did answer the questions, although I don't know why.

Got that Affidavit yet? :p

Actually you have not answered one question logically. Why do you care what we think or spend our money on. The answer is that you do not care. You simply do not have anything better to do. Both you and I and all of the other people on this forum know the truth. You will be much better off when you can admit your own shortcomings to yourself. We all do not care.

[Scooterdog]

Actually you have not answered one question logically. Why do you care what we think or spend our money on. The answer is that you do not care. You simply do not have anything better to do. Both you and I and all of the other people on this forum know the truth. You will be much better off when you can admit your own shortcomings to yourself. We all do not care.

Then why do you respond? I can only assume you sell this bunk, and are part of the scam.

I did answer the questions, you just seem to have a hard time understanding it. Thats YOUR problem, not mine. :)

[H2OPWR]

Then why do you respond? I can only assume you sell this bunk, and are part of the scam.

I did answer the questions, you just seem to have a hard time understanding it. Thats YOUR problem, not mine. :)

Assume all you want. You will never find me selling anything here. I AM TRYING MY BEST TO CONTRIBUTE TO ALL THE GOOD PEOPLE WHO ARE TRYING TO HELP!!!!. This is the last time I will respond to you. I can not beleive I have wasted this much time responding to a total idiot!!!!! I really hope you grow up some day and realize how you present yourself. That is the truth.

[Scooterdog]

Assume all you want. You will never find me selling anything here. I AM TRYING MY BEST TO CONTRIBUTE TO ALL THE GOOD PEOPLE WHO ARE TRYING TO HELP!!!!. This is the last time I will respond to you. I can not beleive I have wasted this much time responding to a total idiot!!!!! I really hope you grow up some day and realize how you present yourself. That is the truth.

Just my opinion, but you seem to have some anger issues. They make pills for that, perhaps you should get some.

Will I find you selling things on ebay, since you claim you won't be selling anything here?

So, after you calling me all these names, making no point whatsoever, I can assume you will not be rebutting my facts? Have a nice day. :p

[Farmercal]

You are leaning out the engine, and it won't last long. No, I wouldn't never attach that crap to my expensive auto, just so I could replace the engine in a short time.

Look, I went to school for this, I know what I'm talking about. I don't care what backyard "mechanic" or some scammer claims. It can't be proven because it is smoke and mirrors. I've provided that math, that cannot be over ridden on a whim. It is fact.

you cannot gain more power from hho by tying into your vehicles electricle system, it's simple math.Scooterdog, now I know you are full of crap. My car has been running lean on it's own for the last two years. It's is still running fine and due to it running lean, I average 40 MPG without HHO. Just how long is short? Two years is not a short time IMO. I had a master mechanic (a REAL mechanic) help me take my head off to check the valves and everything inside the block and head were in great shape. So you have just proven that you don't know what you are taking about. You just like to see your comments in print. Why don't you go back to running your 2.2 million dollar drilling operation.

[Farmercal]

Your questions, are as follows:



My response was simple:



There's your answer. so who's the lier?



Okay, I'm a consultant in the oil field, I would love to see your "returns" lol. We drill the Bakken formation in North Dakota. What is it you do? Oh ya, tinker in a "shop". I'm more than happy to put my tax returns against ANYONES on these sites.
Now I get it. If he really is in the oil business, then we are interfering with his ability to rob us blind selling us oil. Everything done on this site is interfering with his ability to sell more oil. His motivation is oil and the selling of oil and that would explain why he is adamant on convincing as many people as possible the HHO doesn't work. We are taking money away from him by purchasing less gas.

[Scooterdog]

Scooterdog, now I know you are full of crap. My car has been running lean on it's own for the last two years. It's is still running fine and due to it running lean, I average 40 MPG without HHO. Just how long is short? Two years is not a short time IMO. I had a master mechanic (a REAL mechanic) help me take my head off to check the valves and everything inside the block and head were in great shape. So you have just proven that you don't know what you are taking about. You just like to see your comments in print. Why don't you go back to running your 2.2 million dollar drilling operation.

LOL, where's a sworn affidavit, by someone who isn't part of the scam? It doesn't work, and you are lying about it. Huff and puff all you want, "Big oil" didn't screw you, you screwed yourselves. Canada's been paying over 5 bucks a gallon for some time, don't hear them crying about "big oil".

What the hell is a "master mechanic" lol??? What a crock. A tech. school recently tested the water4cash crapola, and the results? Just what I've been saying, less mpg, less hp.

Either prove me wrong, or shut up. You can't prove it wrong, and that's why so many of you who are part of the scam are so irrate. Popular Mech, Cananad, Berkly, Consumer affairs, etc... have debunked this. Either you are part of the scam, or two stupid to realize you've been taken.

[Riddler250]

A master mechanic is someone who has been certified by ase standards

[RMForbes]

What the hell is a "master mechanic" lol??? What a crock.

I guess you don't need to get any certifications in your industry. But here in the USA we have to certified by ASE to be a professional mechanic and get bonded. ASE has several certifications and Master Mechanic is the highest certification available. I'm not sure how many years of experience is required to qualify to take the Master Mechanic examination, but my ASE certification for Diagnostics required at least 5 years of experience before you could even take the test.

[Scooterdog]

ASE are general test's, anyone can get them. I've never heard of a master mechanic, must be someone in the backyard after a couple of years.

I have heard of master tecnicians.

Nobody with any creditials will back this **** up.

[Riddler250]

Scooter, you have brought this forum down enough. I for one am getting tired of it. I will no longer be a part of any discussions with you and will put you on my ignore list. If I could boot you off this site I would, but its not mine. If more people on here would do the same. You will eventually go away. Unless you have something productive to say. You can question this technology all you want, but please do it in a respective manner, and quit disrupting us from being productive. You have nothing to lose by us doing this and nothing to gain by being a royal pain. I'm sure you will have some smart a** comment for this but I will not dignify it with a response. Now good day.

[Scooterdog]

Scooter, you have brought this forum down enough. I for one am getting tired of it. I will no longer be a part of any discussions with you and will put you on my ignore list. If I could boot you off this site I would, but its not mine. If more people on here would do the same. You will eventually go away. Unless you have something productive to say. You can question this technology all you want, but please do it in a respective manner, and quit disrupting us from being productive. You have nothing to lose by us doing this and nothing to gain by being a royal pain. I'm sure you will have some smart a** comment for this but I will not dignify it with a response. Now good day.

Stop your whining. If you don't like it, don't respond. You can't prove anything I've said is incorrect, and it just chaps your ass! Well do bad! You will never prove this crap works, because it simply doesn't, never has, never will.

"I won't dignify it with a response" , are you kidding!? You just keep responding as I keep letting the cat out of the bag on this flim-flam scam.

[scrode]

ASE are general test's, anyone can get them. I've never heard of a master mechanic, must be someone in the backyard after a couple of years.

I have heard of master tecnicians.

Nobody with any creditials will back this **** up.

If you can read scooterpie,:eek: this explains a ase master mechanic ase master mechanic (http://online.onetcenter.org/link/summary/49-3023.01):D
and if you aren't satisfied there try googling "ase master mechanic". I know your afraid to learn something that your cousins sister hasn't told you but you'll be ok. really

[Scooterdog]

If you can read scooterpie,:eek: this explains a ase master mechanic ase master mechanic (http://online.onetcenter.org/link/summary/49-3023.01):D
and if you aren't satisfied there try googling "ase master mechanic". I know your afraid to learn something that your cousins sister hasn't told you but you'll be ok. really

ASE certification you get while in school. I have it, it means nothing, they are simple basic test's given to students before graduation in real technical schools. Sure, the people at autozone and probably the walmart tire shop have them too. So what.

I'm a certified technician, and it goes far beyone ASE. ASE certificatioins are a joke, plain and simple.

I think the problem you have is this is taking time from play x-box. Get an education, then come back.

[H2OPWR]

Scooter, you have brought this forum down enough. I for one am getting tired of it. I will no longer be a part of any discussions with you and will put you on my ignore list. If I could boot you off this site I would, but its not mine. If more people on here would do the same. You will eventually go away. Unless you have something productive to say. You can question this technology all you want, but please do it in a respective manner, and quit disrupting us from being productive. You have nothing to lose by us doing this and nothing to gain by being a royal pain. I'm sure you will have some smart a** comment for this but I will not dignify it with a response. Now good day.

Riddler, Since I have put him on ignore I actually enjoy my time hear again. None of his posts even show up to read. I CHALLENGE EVERYONE ON THIS FORUM TO BO THE SAME. Then we can get back to HHO and away fron A****LE

[Scooterdog]

Riddler, Since I have put him on ignore I actually enjoy my time hear again. None of his posts even show up to read. I CHALLENGE EVERYONE ON THIS FORUM TO BO THE SAME. Then we can get back to HHO and away fron A****LE

If I were on ignore, I couldn't read your post's. Please, stop the scam and all the lying.

[scrode]

Riddler, Since I have put him on ignore I actually enjoy my time hear again. None of his posts even show up to read. I CHALLENGE EVERYONE ON THIS FORUM TO BO THE SAME. Then we can get back to HHO and away fron A****LE

excellent I did just that

[Scooterdog]

excellent I did just that

Doubt full. More like mom and dad said "its time to go to bed lil scorde". To much computer time and x-box time.

[admin]

Everyone just get along, this is getting annoying.

I don't want to see any attacks or bull**** like this.

This means everyone.:mad: