Right under my nose this whole time

[Riddler250]

his is kind of off the subject of hho, but, I just remembered that i have about 20 12v batteries from working battery backup systems at work that we are throwing out. I would love to get a solar cell, or build a windturbine, or even try one of those motors that are driven by magnets (bendini motor?) to charge those batteries and possibly supply power to a hho gen. But i cant really decide. Any sugestions
David

[Smith03Jetta]

Go Solar. I'm already budgetting for a solar system to power my entire home. In addition, I'm looking into using the solar to bust up water and allow me to store Hydrogen and Oxygen separately for recombination later in a traditional Hydrogen fuel cell to make electricity to power my house at night.

I also have a DREAM!!!!!!! of building a hydrogen fuel cell motorcycle. When I mean Hydrogen Fuel Cell, I do not mean Electrolyzer. I'm talking about making electricity to power an electric motor attached to a chain that's attached to the sprocket on the rear wheel of the motorcycle.

[Riddler250]

Go Solar. I'm already budgetting for a solar system to power my entire home. In addition, I'm looking into using the solar to bust up water and allow me to store Hydrogen and Oxygen separately for recombination later in a traditional Hydrogen fuel cell to make electricity to power my house at night..
I havnt priced cells in a while, so I'm not sure what my coat would be. They did develop a more efficient cell a year or 2 ago but I don't remember what they were called. And I'm sure they are way out of my price range

[Painless]

I'd love to take my home off of the grid too, fuel and electric prices are eating us alive along with everything else.

I watched a documentary recently where they were using lenses to concentrate light onto solar cells, this more than doubled the production. Kind of like burning a piece of paper with a magnifying glass.

[Riddler250]

I'd love to take my home off of the grid too, fuel and electric prices are eating us alive along with everything else.

I watched a documentary recently where they were using lenses to concentrate light onto solar cells, this more than doubled the production. Kind of like burning a piece of paper with a magnifying glass.

The science channel (my wife says I'm a dork) has a series I think its called the green team but they travel the country and look at green inventions. Most of them are just back yard guys. But this one company has a solar cell that weja like a holagram and it seperates the light and only uses the most powerful beams for power. It was pretty cool. I just took a look at the batteries we have in the shop and they are only 7a so I need a bunch of them. Oh and this is a pain using my blackberry.

[Painless]

The science channel (my wife says I'm a dork) has a series I think its called the green team but they travel the country and look at green inventions. Most of them are just back yard guys. But this one company has a solar cell that weja like a holagram and it seperates the light and only uses the most powerful beams for power. It was pretty cool.

Yup! I think that's the program I saw it on, I'm also a science channel freak :)


I just took a look at the batteries we have in the shop and they are only 7a so I need a bunch of them.

At 12v that's 84 watts per battery, how many batteries do you have? That could be a major money saver to already have them.


Oh and this is a pain using my blackberry.

I have a blackberry too and love it! Nice to sit in the comfort of my favourite chair and read the forums :)

[Riddler250]

Yup! I think that's the program I saw it on, I'm also a science channel freak :)



At 12v that's 84 watts per battery, how many batteries do you have? That could be a major money saver to already have them.



I have a blackberry too and love it! Nice to sit in the comfort of my favourite chair and read the forums :)
I think there is about 20 right now. We already threw away close to 50. Most of em still good. I wanted to cry. I'm gonna try and get 10 this week and another 10 next week.

I just use my blackberry at work. I spend a lot of time in the trunks of cars and its hard to keep a computer in there with me along with tools

[fisher]

Look at Northern Hydraulics product magazine if you have a Northern near you.
Also, mrsolar.com

[HydroFarmer]

Check out [URL="http://redrok.com"] This site will keep you busy for a while. You can easily achieve 500 F at the focal point of a dish with just a emergency space blanket from Walmarts for 3 bucks. However the sun just doesn't shine often here in Michigan.

[resago]

for the money, wind is still cheaper.

[hydrotinkerer]

While your talking about alternative power sources. What about TEG, Thermoelectric generators? The guy I was talking to said four 12volt Teg's would power 15amps. I don't know anything about them. I was curious if this was really an option. He gave a site address: http://www.hi-z.com/store.php

[Riddler250]

While your talking about alternative power sources. What about TEG, Thermoelectric generators? The guy I was talking to said four 12volt Teg's would power 15amps. I don't know anything about them. I was curious if this was really an option. He gave a site address: http://www.hi-z.com/store.php

I have been studying those for a while now. He claims 5% efficiency, which is possible with a really good thermal couple most i found are 4%. They have been discussed on this forum briefly as a way to power your hho gen from the heat coming off of the exhaust manifold. The problem i have with tegs is the price/efficiency ratio. his lower model is $60, produces 3.3v 2.5watts. it takes a 200 degree variance to "produce" this power. Im really bad at math so I cant figure how long it would take to pay for itself. Im not saying tegs are bad, the technology works, and has been in use for many years. There is a town in germany i think that has built a few tall towers, at the top of these towers is a huge teg. on the ground is a butt load of mirrors reflecting the sun to the tower. creating a high temp variance. they power a small town and produce no emmisions. until the cost of thermalcouples comes down, (i think most use silicon) they are only really good as relay triggers to most people like us.
That is just my opinion that is based on what I read. I reccomend doing your own research and coming to your own conclusion.

[resago]

they are all over ebay. 156watt for $10.
TEG, also known as TEC and Peltier device.

[Riddler250]

they are all over ebay. 156watt for $10.
TEG, also known as TEC and Peltier device.

thanks for the lookout. ill check em out. Im going to talk to my boss about all them batteries tonight. hopefully he will say yes. 20 12v 7a batteries!

[Riddler250]

they are all over ebay. 156watt for $10.
TEG, also known as TEC and Peltier device.
156watts and 12v is input. a peltier device uses electricity to generate hot and cold. its the exact same the only difference in the peltier device and what you really want is what the semiconductor is made of. if you read descriptions on the auctions you will notice that they are used to heat and cool based on the input of the voltage out in. They work both ways. read up on the seebeck effect, that is what you are looking for, the problem with thermal couples is they typically have a maximum output in microvolts. I will find a spec sheet and explain it if you like.

[resago]

used em in supercooling a PC.

haven't actually used them in energy generation, but its the same device.
if its 5%, then the 165watt version would output 8 watts given enough temp differential. thats less than an amp at 12v.

I had an idea to get a 1ft sq sheet of Al and paint one side black, mount a tec and heatsink to the underside and see what kind of power can be made in the noontime heat.

[Riddler250]

used em in supercooling a PC.

haven't actually used them in energy generation, but its the same device.
if its 5%, then the 165watt version would output 8 watts given enough temp differential. thats less than an amp at 12v.

I had an idea to get a 1ft sq sheet of Al and paint one side black, mount a tec and heatsink to the underside and see what kind of power can be made in the noontime heat.
You are right, it is the exact same device. Like I said before, its only 5% but its better than nothing. I was going to get a copper sheet and wire a thermopile in between 2 sheets of copper. if I can get 12v and 1amp i can still trickle charge a battery bank, better than nothing

[donnylynn]

I was going to get a copper sheet and wire a thermopile in between 2 sheets of copper. if I can get 12v and 1amp i can still trickle charge a battery bank, better than nothing

I believe you will need many more than 1 thermocouple to get the voltage and current you need. A thermocouple puts out only a few millivolts. The TEC's use a large number of them wired in series. probably why they cost what they do.

[resago]

here's a 400 watt'r
http://cgi.ebay.com/Awesome-400W-Thermoelectric-Peltier-Cooler-12-VDC-TEC_W0QQitemZ310091130364QQcmdZViewItem?hash=item3 10091130364&_trkparms=72%3A1205|39%3A1|66%3A4|65%3A12|240%3A13 18&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14

BTW use silver paste, and clamping pressure is crucial!! As tight as you can get it without crushing.
if you use nylon bolts, you can tighten to the point of stripping the threads and the TEC will be fine.

[Riddler250]

I believe you will need many more than 1 thermocouple to get the voltage and current you need. A thermocouple puts out only a few millivolts. The TEC's use a large number of them wired in series. probably why they cost what they do.
Actually a thermal couple's out put is usually in microvolts

[resago]

ya know, a more efficient use of the heat would be a steam turbine generator.

[Riddler250]

The cool thing about thermopiles is that they can be used anywhere. I just wish they were more efficient. maybe i will just get a solar panel to trickle charge my batteries. Wont be able to run my house, but maybe a small heater for a day or two if power goes out in the winter. I still like thermocouples, you just have to remember that 5% is better than 0%

[Retro]

ya know, a more efficient use of the heat would be a steam turbine generator.

Ever heard of a tri-generation plant?

[Retro]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cogeneration

Trigeneration or combined cooling, heat and power (CCHP) refers to the simultaneous generation of electricity and useful heating and cooling from the combustion of a fuel or a solar heat collector.

http://www.clarke-energy.com/gas-engines/trigeneration/

[Retro]

I have heard of methods of salvaging heat from waste water to heat water for bathing, using cross-flow heat exchangers and small heat pumps.

Had wondered if the same thing might be done with the hot air exhausted from a clothes drier, preheating dry incoming air, and maybe use a heat pump to salvage even more heat. Sounds a bit complicated, but I wonder about the gains in efficiency.