My booster exploded. but why?

[pj91gsx]

The cap on the booster melted on the negative side and I dont understand why. The plastic melted so much that the cable loosened up and the wire must have wiggled and spark and the booster just lit up. Why would the plastic melt on the ground side? I am using smacks booster design.

[bigapple]

The cap on the booster melted on the negative side and I dont understand why. The plastic melted so much that the cable loosened up and the wire must have wiggled and spark and the booster just lit up. Why would the plastic melt on the ground side? I am using smacks booster design.

Be sure that you have no shorts in your system. And make sure the ratio of positives to negatives is equal. Although you can only make as much hydrogen as is proportionate to equal production of oxygen, if you have a smaller amount of negatives or positives, they will have to work harder and get hotter to even out the ratio.

[pj91gsx]

Be sure that you have no shorts in your system. And make sure the ratio of positives to negatives is equal. Although you can only make as much hydrogen as is proportionate to equal production of oxygen, if you have a smaller amount of negatives or positives, they will have to work harder and get hotter to even out the ratio.

I drove with it for 2 times and 2 hrs or more each time, then it popped. I dont under stand why the pvc cap has a melted hole in it on the negative terminal. would it just be the pvc?

[bigapple]

I drove with it for 2 times and 2 hrs or more each time, then it popped. I dont under stand why the pvc cap has a melted hole in it on the negative terminal. would it just be the pvc?

Well, I'd also make sure the connections are solid and dense. If you use smaller wire or if the current has to run through a lose connection, it can cause heat to rise.

It could be the PVC but I wouldn't know that for sure. I've chosen to stay away from PVC due to the fact that it loses its rigidity due to heat after a while. Lexan Polycarbonate has become my material of choice. If you keep having issues, I'd switch materials.

[javierf]

pj91gsx, that's precisely the problem with most electrolyzers, and which most people don't address. It's very nice to see an electrolyzer generate 2, 2.5 or more LPM. However, most won't stand long periods of operation without overheating and melting the components.

The fact your negative terminal was the one that melted is absolutely normal. The negative electrode will always (in my experience) get hotter than the positive (assuming the same number of plates of each).

I suggest you run your electrolyzer on a bench with the exact wattage (volts & amperage) as when it's in your car, for a couple of hours and monitor the electrolyte's temperature continuosly to see if it has a runaway heat/current problem.

[H2OPWR]

Use more n plates and a PWM to control current and the problem will go away. Also many people use too small guage wire that causes excessive heating. Another possible cause would be poor quality stainless bolts. Stainless is not a very good conductor and poor quality is even worse.

[scrode]

Ive built a couple generators out of ABS and have never had a failure due to heat even with my first one, that would heat up enough to boil the water. Then I went with the +nnnnn- setup and haven't had a problem with heat since.

[Smith03Jetta]

I've already warned everybody about the Smack type boosters. They do put out a lot of HHO but they get hot. PVC is not made for that type of heat. PERIOD. You should stop wasting your time and money with PVC or any other weak plastic.

Here's a rule of thumb... Don't use any material that is not rated for at least 200F. Even if the water does not get hot, if you have a short the metal, bolts and wires can heat up rather quickly.

I also use a heavy gauge negative wire (8) and a light gauge positive wire (14). If I get a short it will be on the positive fused side of my cell. I'm also using a 40 amp fuse. It is there only to protect my car's wiring harness. I keep a good eye on the amp draw using my in-dash ammeter. Consistent 15 amps right now...

My mistake I had to go back and switch the gauge wires that I reported above...

[Farmercal]

I've already warned everybody about the Smack type boosters. They do put out a lot of HHO but they get hot. PVC is not made for that type of heat. PERIOD. You should stop wasting your time and money with PVC or any other weak plastic.

Here's a rule of thumb... Don't use any material that is not rated for at least 200F. Even if the water does not get hot, if you have a short the metal, bolts and wires can heat up rather quickly.

I also use a heavy gauge negative wire (14) and a light gauge positive wire (8). If I get a short it will be on the positive fused side of my cell. I'm also using a 40 amp fuse. It is there only to protect my car's wiring harness. I keep a good eye on the amp draw using my in-dash ammeter. Consistent 15 amps right now...
I thought the lower the number the thicker the wire.

[pj91gsx]

The failures are in the ground wire, which I will put a bigger wire, the blots ont he top for the connection were not stainless, neither were the nuts connecting the plates, I am installing stainless nuts and hard wear for the connection, added a better ground wire and am going to try to get a glass mason jar and see how it will do. I drive for about 6 minutes a day so the pvc might not have time to overheat will it?

[bigapple]

The failures are in the ground wire, which I will put a bigger wire, the blots ont he top for the connection were not stainless, neither were the nuts connecting the plates, I am installing stainless nuts and hard wear for the connection, added a better ground wire and am going to try to get a glass mason jar and see how it will do. I drive for about 6 minutes a day so the pvc might not have time to overheat will it?

I had problems with my wires overheating for the longest time and finally decided to do it big or go home. Most people suggest a 10-8 gauge wire for the positive and negative terminal to prevent heat buildup. Since I had a giftcard to Best Buy with some free money, I bought Rockford Fosgate 4 gauge speaker wire and some large wire crimps for them. I ran all of this through a 40 amp circuit breaker and 40 amp relay to my battery and heat issues are never caused by my wiring anymore. I'd say go ahead and get big wire (although 1 or 0 gauge is probably ridiculous overkill). I'd go ahead and be safe and get 4 or 6 gauge wire. Then you can limit down your heating issues to the generator and not your connections

[pj91gsx]

I had problems with my wires overheating for the longest time and finally decided to do it big or go home. Most people suggest a 10-8 gauge wire for the positive and negative terminal to prevent heat buildup. Since I had a giftcard to Best Buy with some free money, I bought Rockford Fosgate 4 gauge speaker wire and some large wire crimps for them. I ran all of this through a 40 amp circuit breaker and 40 amp relay to my battery and heat issues are never caused by my wiring anymore. I'd say go ahead and get big wire (although 1 or 0 gauge is probably ridiculous overkill). I'd go ahead and be safe and get 4 or 6 gauge wire. Then you can limit down your heating issues to the generator and not your connections

cool. today I changed all the nuts to stainless steel ones, half were stainless and half were not. im not installing it back in just yet. My potash is on the way, and Im going to look around for a new container. From what it looks like the pvc melted at both terminals but really bad at the negative and the wire must have wiggled and sparked.

[Smith03Jetta]

I went back and corrected my post where I made a mistake earlier. I use lighter 14 gauge wire for positive and heavier 8 gauge wire for negative. I'm pulling only 15 amps so this size wire is just fine. No overheating at terminals or wires.

[EltonBrandd]

The failures are in the ground wire, which I will put a bigger wire, the blots ont he top for the connection were not stainless, neither were the nuts connecting the plates, I am installing stainless nuts and hard wear for the connection, added a better ground wire and am going to try to get a glass mason jar and see how it will do. I drive for about 6 minutes a day so the PVC might not have time to overheat will it?

Make sure your negative connections in the generator are tight. And use an ABS cap, it will stand up to higher temps.

[H2OPWR]

Also you might try CPVC instead of plain PVC. CPVC has a much higher melting and forming temp and will still glue the same way as PVC.

[pj91gsx]

Also you might try CPVC instead of plain PVC. CPVC has a much higher melting and forming temp and will still glue the same way as PVC.

ok. I may consider it, the only melting issue I had was the cap where the electrical connections were so it seems like the cap just needs to be stronger and hopefully it will last.

[Smith03Jetta]

Good idea about the cap. Now keep in mind that even if the cap can withstand higher temperatures it does not mean that you can run your generator at high temperatures all the time. Eventually your other parts will fail and you will start to develop leaks around the screw-on lid.

[pj91gsx]

If I had the proper container, could I run the booster at higher temperatures all the time? Im not too conserned about the piping itself, because I have it in the bumper where it must be getting cooled of really well.

[hydrotinkerer]

cool. today I changed all the nuts to stainless steel ones, half were stainless and half were not. im not installing it back in just yet. My potash is on the way, and Im going to look around for a new container. From what it looks like the pvc melted at both terminals but really bad at the negative and the wire must have wiggled and sparked.

After I melted my first pvc cap I changed how I bolted the conductors through the cap. I ran the bolt through the ss strap then put a nut on it and tightened it down. Then I run the bolt through the cap and put a nut on it and tightened it down. By doing this you don't use the cap to keep tension on the connection. So the assembly order goes: bolt, gen connector, nut(tighten), pvc cap, washer and nut(tighten). So far its worked for me. Hope that helps.

[Smith03Jetta]

You have to think like an engineer when you are building something like this. Just because it feels solid doesn't mean it is solid. All plastics have heat tolerances at which they will melt but if you run a bolt through it and tighten nuts on each side you apply a great deal of pressure to the plastic. Now if you heat the bolt you concentrate heat and pressure in one spot on the plastic. It is just a matter of time before the plastic/pvc/abs will start to squish. That makes the bolt loose. The plastic will start to squish at a lower temperature than what it is rated for. That's why I suggest starting with a material with a really high temperature rating. That way you have more to work with..

If you start with PVC - Melting point 176°F 80°C - Hardness R105 - If you apply pressure along with the heat you could possibly reduce it's melting point to around 120 to 130F.

Pelican cases claim to be heat resistant up to 210F 98.9C.
I've done some research and the copolymer polypropylene material that they are actually made of has a melting point of 327F 164C. I think the reason why they claim a lower temperature resistance is because the latches they use on their cases are made of ABS. The Rockwell hardness of the cp material is R92. It is somewhat less hard than PVC but it will not shatter like PVC. It can withstand impact a lot better.

If you want a good material to build a wet cell from I would suggest that you either find a Pelican case the right size or start searching for something made from Copolymer Polypropylene.

[Scooterdog]

If I had the proper container, could I run the booster at higher temperatures all the time? Im not too conserned about the piping itself, because I have it in the bumper where it must be getting cooled of really well.

You could try to use male/female connectors. Make the hole the size of the connector, glue it in place. That would reduce resistance. You could wire direct, and glue around the wire, but you wouldn't be able to disconnect it.

I've been thinking about this with metal lids. Make the hole a little bigger, put in a non-conducting insert, extend it a little bit on top and bottom so you are sure not to have bolt/metal contact. Just a thought.

Hook a a volt/ohms meter and see what is going on.

[pj91gsx]

thanks for the replys. I found a jar that will work at walmart for 3.50. Is there any fear of anything happening to the jar? Will it melt my plastic bumper, could the glass not be thick enough?

[Smith03Jetta]

You are engineering a device to be added to your BMW to improve it's gas mileage. I really don't think the following words belong in your posts.

1. $3.50
2. Walmart
3. Jar
4. Glass

[DaneDHorstead]

After I melted my first pvc cap I changed how I bolted the conductors through the cap. I ran the bolt through the ss strap then put a nut on it and tightened it down. Then I run the bolt through the cap and put a nut on it and tightened it down. By doing this you don't use the cap to keep tension on the connection. So the assembly order goes: bolt, gen connector, nut(tighten), pvc cap, washer and nut(tighten). So far its worked for me. Hope that helps.
It also helps to use rubber washers between flat stainless steel washers before tightening the connector bolts. Also, I add a little Goop, between the top rubber washer, and the ABS cap, so when it tightens, it fills in around the bolt as it passes through the ABS.

Always tighten the straps with a nut, before inserting washers, etc., and always use absolutely nothing except quality stainless steel fasteners, lockwashers, washers, nuts, etc.

Even adding just one item that is not proper stainless steel, will cause corrosion, and cause a loosening of the connection, and possible sparks.

That is what caused the problem to this man's generator, in the first place.

[Scooterdog]

thanks for the replys. I found a jar that will work at walmart for 3.50. Is there any fear of anything happening to the jar? Will it melt my plastic bumper, could the glass not be thick enough?

Maybe I misse this: What kind of jar? The glass will get hot no matter the thickness. dont' you have a fuse in there somewhere? Do you have room to put aluminum foil in the bumper area?? If you use enough, it may disapate the heat before it reaches your plastic bumper, you don't want to warp it. Just a thought.

You could do alum. foil, rubber(from a tube)alum. foil, rubber etc...

[pj91gsx]

Maybe I misse this: What kind of jar? The glass will get hot no matter the thickness. dont' you have a fuse in there somewhere? Do you have room to put aluminum foil in the bumper area?? If you use enough, it may disapate the heat before it reaches your plastic bumper, you don't want to warp it. Just a thought.

You could do alum. foil, rubber(from a tube)alum. foil, rubber etc...

there is plenty of room im thinking of setting it on a wood block. and putting screws around it that stick up to hold it in place.

[Scooterdog]

there is plenty of room im thinking of setting it on a wood block. and putting screws around it that stick up to hold it in place.

Yes sir, that would work too. Unless it's getting so hot it could ignite the wood lol.

[pj91gsx]

Yes sir, that would work too. Unless it's getting so hot it could ignite the wood lol.

lol. scooterdog, have you calmed down? are you good? maybe claim that your account was hacked into.:D